Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[bk]

Oh, and tell more about the Long Beach She Loves Me - worth going out to see?  That's a show and score I love.

[bk]

And one for Mahler.

[Jay]

Well, it would have to be the fourth Plaid, Guy Stroman.

And we have a winner!

[bk]

I'm a winner!  Speaking of winners, it is going to be a perfectly perfect and stunningly stunning day here in Los Angeles, California, USA.  

[DERBRUCER]

The first thing I did when I got out of bed was go to the garage, unlock my car and make sure my wallet was safe and sound (as well as my ATM and license).  They were.

You leave your wallet with ATM and license in the car

Such a trusting soul!

der Brucer

[DERBRUCER]

..Have a fondness for "A Doll's Life" though. Saw a "Reading" of it a few years ago. (no scripts in sight!)

You should hear our own Penny O sing it!



Penny Orloff (center) with George Hearn and Betsy Joslyn in the Broadway Production of "A Doll's Life" directed by Hal Prince.

der Brucer

Herewith another lovely trio:

[Jay]

Jay, I know you liked Grand Hotel - let's hear your take on it, so we have balanced reporting here at haineshisway.com.

Actually, we're not that far apart.  I did see Grand Hotel once when it played on Broadway.  My recollections of it are quite positive, but not nearly as specific as yours, Dear BK, save for Mr. Michael Jeter's performance, which was amazing.

I believe a good part of my enjoyment of the Burbank production stems from the intimacy of the Colony Theatre.  Although I wish the show had been done uncut, in the form in which it was done the focus is very much on the individual stories of the lead characters, adding to that intimacy.  

While the Colony's Baron (Robert J. Townsend) is no Brent Barrett or David Carroll, I did like his voice and he succeeded in conveying the Baron's noblesse quite well.  To my eye, Jason did a fine job, and his chemistry with the Baron and Flaemmchen was tangible.  I thought the two dancers were downright excellent.  The other players, too, were quite good, but, I will agree, not as memorable in their performance as the Broadway cast.  But they were good, and good performances in a credible production of a show of this magnitude on a local stage makes me happy.

[DERBRUCER]

Riding back form a recent outing, Woody played our “Heigh-Ho! Mozart” CD – favorite Disney tunes in the style of the Great Classical Composers. Selections ala Mozart, Rachmaninoff, Jopin, Vivaldi,  Bartók, et al. Listening to these tracks really gives you an appreciation for how much arrangements contribute to the overall voice of a composer.

How much of what I hear in “Victory At Sea” is Richard Rodgers and how much is Robert Russell Bennett?

Indeed, maybe Bennett is a great deal of the “sound” of Broadway.

IMDB reports:

...in 1922 (Bennett) became an arranger for Broadway musicals; his productions included "Rose-Marie", "Sunny", "The Band Wagon", "Of Thee I Sing", "The Cat and the Fiddle", "Face the Music", "Show Boat", "Oklahoma!", "Carousel", "Kiss Me, Kate", "South Pacific", "The King and I", "The Sound of Music", "My Fair Lady", and "Camelot".

Are there other arrangers who should get “over the title” billing along with the composers?

Which composers should get full credit for arranging their own compositons.

Are there hidden talents – arrangers quietly ghosting with no attribution?

Der Brucer (expecting we’ll hear from one particular poster)

[Jay]

Oh, and tell more about the Long Beach She Loves Me - worth going out to see?  That's a show and score I love.

Me, too, as I think you know.  This is only the second production of She Loves Me that I've ever seen.  The first was just a couple of years ago at Reprise!

What recommends this production are the outstanding vocal and acting performances by Mr. John Bisom as Georg, Miss Teri Bibb as Amalia, and Mr. Stan Chandler as Steven.  

The Reprise! production had considerably more charm, and was far more competently cast in the other parts.  Long Beach sort of botches the scene in the cafe, has Arpad climb into the hospital bed with Mr. Maraczek, and interpolates "The Twelve Days of Christmas" into the "Twelve Days to Christmas" sequence.  

It's not a bad production but it could be a much better one.

[bk]

Sounds like they're just ripping Scott Ellis' Roundabout production.

[DERBRUCER]

TOD

As a lad my favorite “play house” was a medieval castle complete with working portcullis and drawbridge, It had battlements where I could mount my well-armed knights to defend against the attack of Evil King John. Because of all the fantasy reading I did, I was much more into Knights in Shining Armour than Cowboys and Indians – and since it was during WWII, toy soldiers were out of vogue (although I had a cousin who poured his own tin solders). If I had a Charlie Pogue in my neighborhood, we could have had hours of adventure.

On the distaff side of the family were some cousins for whom their grandfather had built a marvelous 2 story doll house – it was about 2 foot wide, 18 inches deep and a foot high.

The rooms all had wallpaper and miniature electric lights. It had magnificent hand crafted furniture imported from Europe. It was always on display at Christmas time. Imagine what it would fetch on EBay today!

Do people still set up grand and glorious Christmas gardens for their kids? Wonderful Lionel train layouts with rolling hills covered with artificial snow and grassy fields with miniature farms complete with tiny animals. (One memorable Christmas I was at an Uncle’s, playing with the trains. The locomotive ran over a stretch of track that was covered with Angel Hair which immediately burst into a ball of flame. My Uncle screamed “Fire” and grabbed the nearest thing he could reach to smoother the flames – the nearest thing being my Mother’s new fur coat!  It was a truly memorable Christmas.

der Brucer (remembering all the wonderful children’s toys I used to have – hand made imports from Germany – a particular favorite was a cast iron, hand painted, piggy bank)

[Jay]

I must now sojourn to the County of Orange for a big hat luncheon with The Dear Mother, after which we shall hie ourselves to Opera Pacific for a performance of Mr. Giacomo Puccini's Turandot.  Report later.

[elmore3003]

My comings and goings over the course of last week have precipitated what is likely to be a very easy trivia contest for all you precious Dear Readers out there in the dark:

Last Sunday I went to Long Beach to see a production of She Loves Me, in which Mr. Stan Chandler played the role of Steven Kodaly.

Last Wednesday I went to the Pasadena Playhouse to once again see Side by Side by Sondheim, in which Mr. David Engel is now featured as the male vocalist.

On Friday, I went to Burbank to see Grand Hotel, in which Mr. Jason Graae starred as Otto Kringelein.

One more person and I'd have a complete set.  

Who is that person?

What is the bond that unites these four?

Is it Larry Rabin and the Plaids?

[elmore3003]

Me, too, as I think you know.  This is only the second production of She Loves Me that I've ever seen.  The first was just a couple of years ago at Reprise!

What recommends this production are the outstanding vocal and acting performances by Mr. John Bisom as Georg, Miss Teri Bibb as Amalia, and Mr. Stan Chandler as Steven.  

The Reprise! production had considerably more charm, and was far more competently cast in the other parts.  Long Beach sort of botches the scene in the cafe, has Arpad climb into the hospital bed with Mr. Maraczek, and interpolates "The Twelve Days of Christmas" into the "Twelve Days to Christmas" sequence.  

It's not a bad production but it could be a much better one.

Well, I lost on the Plaids!  I guess Larry replaced Jason.

The "Twelve Days of Christmas" is nonsense from the Roundabout revival, which is the show MTI is sending out these days.  I don't know if the original Don Walker orchestration is still available for rent now.

[bk]

I'll have full info in tomorrow's notes, but if someone would like to be a guinea pig and be among the first to order Writer's Block, the site is up and running right now.  Simply go to www.writersblocksite.com and nose around.

[elmore3003]

[quote author=DERBRUCER link=board=4;threadid=470;start=msg76264#msg76264 date=1100454348

How much of what I hear in “Victory At Sea” is Richard Rodgers and how much is Robert Russell Bennett?

Indeed, maybe Bennett is a great deal of the “sound” of Broadway.

Are there other arrangers who should get “over the title” billing along with the composers?

Which composers should get full credit for arranging their own compositons.

Are there hidden talents – arrangers quietly ghosting with no attribution?

Der Brucer (expecting we’ll hear from one particular poster)

Well, I don't know if I'm the one you were expecting, but I'll jump in!
"Victory at Sea" is mostly Bennett, I believe.  I've never seen what Rodgers gave him, but it's always been my understanding that Russell Bennett had around 5-20 themes Rodgers gave him and that all development of this material to suit the film was written by Russell Bennett.   You might enjoy the newly edited autobiography of Russell Bennett, DRDB.

With Jerome Kern, both Frank Saddler and his successor Russell Bennett would take down on paper what Kern played on the piano and then brush it up into a piano-vocal for Kern to edit.  Then they would orchestrate it.  The Library of Congress has the entire vocal score for SHOW BOAT in ink by Russell Bennett, with all of Bennett's vocal arrangements.  I gather something similar was the case with Cole Porter.

Phillip J. Lang is the unsung hero for Bob Merrill, who plinked out his melodies on a toy xylophone.  Lang harmonized and scored everything, so a show like CARNIVAL or NEW GIRL IN TOWN owes a great deal to Lang.

Bernstein, Blitzstein, Gershwin, Kurt Weill, Rodgers, Frederick Lowe, and Sondheim wrote it all out and expected their orchestrators to score what they put on paper.  I've had composers on shows give me lead sheets (melody lines and chord symbols) which meant every accompaniment decision became mine.

I heard that Hershy Kay on one show had the entire orchestra in unison play the tune and when the composer yelled "what was that?" Hershy answered "Exactly what you gave me."

[Noel]

Scholars argue over how much Robert Russell Bennett had to do with Victory At Sea, and how much was Richard Rodgers.  This past week's Broadway Radio Show with Donald Feltham begs a similar question.  The dance music in musicals is usually NOT the work of the composer of the songs.

But, in all of the above, what usually happens is that an arranger bases his work on themes by the "name" composer.

The Music of the Night - a song only a dog could love.  Maybe, after Cats, this was Andrew Lloyd Webber's goal.  I find its soaring bridge, with its bit of harmonic traveling, the tastiest part of Phantom of the Opera, but the part that isn't the bridge, well...

In Forget Paris, Billy Crystal says The Music of the Night is stolen from an old song called School Days.  Others have pointed out that the same theme, when played in 3/4, is Come To Me Bend To Me's first few bars.  When confronted with this, Lloyd Webber said he meant this as a tribute to Alan Jay Lerner, Come To Me's lyricist, with whom he'd planned to collaborate on Phantom of the Opera.  I actually think that would have made a good combination.  Imagine if Lloyd Webber actually worked with an experienced librettist/lyricist with a proven track record!  Well, Alan Jay Lerner died (please don't abbreviate his middle name - he hated that) and so Lloyd Webber went out and replaced him with a 20-year-old kid who'd never done anything before and has done very little since, Charles Hart.  You wonder how these things begin.

But we should move on, past those bars that sound like School Days and before that admirable bridge, and the "turn your head away" is a direct steal from Puccini's Girl of the Golden West.  Not a note changed.  But then, the Phantom lurks in an opera house, so it makes a certain sense that he should warble an opera tune...

I mean, it makes much more sense than warbling a Threepenny Opera tune (Weill, 1928, Ballad of the Easy Life) over an eight-to-the-bar pounding bass disco beat.  That would be the title song.

[Noel]

I'm enjoying poking around the WritersBlockSite.
In fact, I'm going to restart my computer now to make sure I don't get disconnected in the middle of enjoying it.

[td]

What are your favorite rock and roll movies?

THE LAST WALTZ - especially The Staples, Van Morrison and Emmy Lou Harris.
TOMMY - Don't like The Who, per se, but, I have quite a fondness for the film.
VIVA LAS VEGAS - George Sydney actually got a performance out of Elvis!  Or was it Ann-Margret who gave him acting tips?  Either way, it's a delight from start to finish.
HEDWIG, of course is a rock and roll movie.
A BLACK AND WHITE NIGHT - Roy Orbison and an all star band that has Bonnie Raitt, k d lang and Jennifer Warnes as backup singers.
THE APPLE
NO NUKES - if only for The Boss' live version of "The River."
HELP!
A HARD DAY'S NIGHT
WHAT'S LOVE GOT TO DO WITH IT? - Angela Basset is amazing as Tina Turner.

[elmore3003]

.

Are there hidden talents – arrangers quietly ghosting with no attribution?

Because of the time constraints on shows, a lot of them have ghosting:  Don Walker was so tied up with the ballet in Act Two of CAROUSEL that a lot of the second act was farmed out to colleagues.  ANYTHING GOES was scored in 1934 by Russell Bennett and Hans Spialek, who both worked on THE GAY DIVORCE.  The first memory I have of seeing more than one orchestrator credited is for  WHERE'S CHARLEY, which had Ted Royal, Phillip Lang, and Hans Spialek.  The next is MY FAIR LADY by Bennett and Lang, who also did NEW GIRL IN TOWN and CAMELOT together.  Steven Suskin has been researching all the ghosting done for Don Walker in the 1950s on PAJAMA GAME, DAMN YANKEES and others.

On THE SOUND OF MUSIC and SHOW BOAT, Russell Bennett was asked to clear his calendar so there would be no ghosting.  I know that Jonathan Tunick and Bill Brohn had work in the 1960s Lincoln Center revival of SHOW BOAT, but Bennett was probably tired of the show by then after having done the 1927 original, the 1928 London, the 1930s film, and the 1940s revival by himself!

[DERBRUCER]

I'll have full info in tomorrow's notes, but if someone would like to be a guinea pig and be among the first to order Writer's Block, the site is up and running right now.  Simply go to www.writersblocksite.com and nose around.

Done!
Love
Mr. G. Pig

[DERBRUCER]

Well, I don't know if I'm the one you were expecting, but I'll jump in!

Indeed you were. Now for the tough part:

In language comprehensible to an engineer, explain the difference between "arranging" and "orchestrating".

der Brucer

[elmore3003]

Scholars argue over how much Robert Russell Bennett had to do with Victory At Sea, and how much was Richard Rodgers.  The dance music in musicals is usually NOT the work of the composer of the songs.

But, in all of the above, what usually happens is that an arranger bases his work on themes by the "name" composer.

 the "turn your head away" is a direct steal from Puccini's Girl of the Golden West.  Not a note changed.  But then, the Phantom lurks in an opera house, so it makes a certain sense that he should warble an opera tune...

DRNoel,  Russell Bennett was always very tactful about his collaboration with Mr Rodgers, and I think Rodgers both liked his work and his tact.  I think Bennett's the best of all:  his orchestrations are like a jeweler's satin box for the music, it all plays well, and seems effortless.  I think it's a tribute to Bennett as well that he's the only orchestrator whose photo hangs on my friend Jonathan Tunick's walls, and I think Jonathan's the best there is right now.  He sets the standard for all of us.

As to dance arrangers, they always get credited, but some of them, like Trude Rittmann, were skilled composers who turned the composer's themes into magic for dance:  her arrangements in BRIGADOON are amazing, and her hornpipe in CAROUSEL based on "Blow High, Blow Low" and the weaving theme is one of my favorite sections of the score.  Did you know that around 90%, if not more, of the ballet "Small House of Uncle Thomas" is hers?

Now to Lloyd Webber, POTO takes place before GIRL OF THE GOLDEN WEST was ever written, possibly before Puccini ever started writing, so I guess Sir Andrew likes GIRL better than FAUST, which is the opera featured in the Leroux novel.

[Charles Pogue]

I'm hoping to catch the Grand Hotel which is being revived at the Donmar Warehouse when I'm in London.

Last night I stopped by Amoeba to pick up BROADWAY: THE GOLDEN AGE.  They were having a $4.99 close-out on a lot of tapes.   I picked up ZULU, GOLDFINGER, the film version of NICKOLAS NICKLEBY, an old TV movie of DAVID COPPERFIELD which I first saw in the seventies with a whole host of British stars like Olivier, Attenborough, Ralph Richardson, Edith Evans, Ron Moody, Michael Redgrave Cyril Cusak, The Young Visitors, and, the most interesting of all, Noel Coward's IN WHICH WE SERVE and which only cost a $1.99!

[td]

Regarding BROADWAY:  THE GOLDEN AGE - did anyone at all feel a bit squeamish at seeing Michelle Lee and Lainie Kazan getting along so well at the premieres? ? ?  Two Gittels for the Seesaw, says I.  

[DERBRUCER]

Rock and Roll movie.   I'm not sure what one of those are.  Does Rocky Horror or Hedwick and the Angry Itch count?

Danise, let me join your confusion.

I would think "Rocky Horror" would count.

I would add "FAME!" to the list.

How about "Blackboard Jungle" -after all it did usher in the era of Rock and Roll.

"Back to the Future"

And surely Lucas' paean to Rock and Roll  "American Graffiti"

(although I enjoyed the Elvis movies, and the Beatles as well, they would not make my "favorites" list)

(I assume movies of musicals like "Grease" or "Bye Bye Birdie" don't count.)

der Brucer

[elmore3003]

Indeed you were. Now for the tough part:

In language comprehensible to an engineer, explain the difference between "arranging" and "orchestrating".

der Brucer

This is a question I get a lot and I find it difficult to answer; I didn't do it well in my unseemly interview, and I'll probably do it badly here as well.  The arrangement determines how the music/song is presented to the listener in terms of accompaniment, mood, style:  the arranger on "Heigh-Ho Mozart" is rewriting the accompanying music, sometimes altering the melodies, to sound like various composers and little of it sounds like the way you've generally heard it performed, either in the Disney films or popular versions over the past 60 years.

Orchestration's a different ballgame since it may entail some arranging (there's some arranging in Ravel's orchestration of "Pictures at an Exhibition" since he doesn't always score what Mussorgsky wrote and often arranges extensions), but the craft of orchestration is to turn a piano part into something that will be played by a group ranging from a combo to a symphony orchestra.  Sometimes the arranger is also the orchestrator, but most of the things I did for BK were arranged by the good, the bad, and the ugly (I mention no names!) in the cabaret world and I then scored what they gave me based on how the number and its arrangement struck my senses.

I regard orchestration as a craft, similar to tinting a black and white photo, turning a monochromatic piano sound into a myriad of orchestral colors.

Arrangements I love:  Ives' Variations on "America" for organ
                             Britten's "Variations on a Theme by Purcell"
                             Anything Nelson Riddle did

Orchestrations:  Ravel's Pictures at An Exhibition
                     Stokowski's Bach pieces
                     William Schuman's scoring of Ives' Variations on "America"
                     Britten's Variations on a Theme by Purcell
                     Anything Nelson Riddle did, along with Russell Bennett, Frank Saddler, Victor Herbert, Don Walker, Jonathan Tunick, Larry Blank,  Hans Spialek, Red Ginzler, Irwin Kostal, and Sid Ramin, and a ton of unacknowledged gentlemen who helped them out.

[Sandra]

Well, it would have to be the fourth Plaid, Guy Stroman.

I finally know the answer to one of the trivia questions, and you have to answer it before I can. Phooey.  

Well, fellow Dear Readers, I can hardly believe it, and yet it is true. I have been reduced to actually doing my homework. It's a take-home test about the shift from Old English to Middle English. And then I have an in-class test on Early Modern English. I think my teacher actually expects me to study.

As long as we're sharing dreams, I dreamed last night that my fencing instructor all of a sudden started speaking with an Italian accent. I woke up thinking, "Where did that come from?"

And then I realized that I have to write five term papers in two weeks.  

[bk]

The order went through so everything is working well.   So, now everyone can order.  If you're thinking of not ordering through the site and buying the book at the stores, I'd only say that I'm not certain if I'll have CDs at the stores or not, and also the book will cost five bucks more plus your local tax at the stores.  

[JoseSPiano]

Good Afternoon!

...I guess I had forgotten just how comfortable my own bed is - and how relatively dark my bedroom is too (my bedroom is in the middle of the apartment, so my windows look out onto the building next door) -  I actually stayed in bed until about 3:00!  Whew!  I do remember getting up briefly around 9:00... Then 11:00... Then 1:30... Then... What?!?!? 3:00!?!?

...And now I'm watching "The Ring" on Cinemax... Good Morning!