Haines His Way
Archives => Archive 3 => Topic started by: bk on April 18, 2005, 11:06:40 PM
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Well, you've read the notes, you need a massage after having read the notes, and now it is time for you to post until the cows come home, which will be as soon as they've all had their massages.
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First post! Huzzah!
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And the word of the day is: HALCYON!
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I'd love to stay and chat but I am exhausted. I hope I will find more time to post tomorrow.
Good night, Good night,
until we meet again,
Adios, Au revoir, Auf Wiedersehen 'til then.
And though it's always sweet sorrow to part
You'll know you'll always remain in my heart.
Good night, sleep tight
and pleasant dreams to you.
Here's a wish and a prayer
That every dream comes true.
And now 'til we, meet again,
Adios, Dobranoc, Auf Wiedersehen.
Goodnight!!! (A Lawrence Welk reference)
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It appears that whatever problems our host was having last night, somehow we reverted to pre daylight savings time in terms of our timestamp. If it hasn't righted itself before morning, I'll drop them a line.
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Good Morning!
-Wow! I really have lost all sense of time. I thought "today" was already Wednesday - I was all set for "Ask BK" day. Consequently, I thought "yesterday" as Tuesday.
-Cue the "Twilight Zone" music...
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As for PC bugaboos...
The one that gets to me - or rather makes me think twice, and sort of confuses me - are how certain ethnicities are labeled, are supposed to be called by. Except, of course, by members of each ethnic group.
"Everyone's a Little Bit Racist" from Avenue Q hits the nail on the head. Over and over again!
:)
"Everyone's a rittle bit lacist"
;)
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As for Shirley Temple movies....
Hmmm... the exact titles escape be right now, so...
-The one in which "On the Good Ship Lollipop" appears.
-The one with the famous stair dance with Bill "Bojangles" Robinson. -Talk about PC!
-And the one where her father goes off to war, and she's sent off to a girl's home. She gets treated badly by everyone there. She's told her father is dead. She has a fabulous dream/fantasy sequence. Then is happily reunited with her father - after a few close "misses".
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OK - Laundry is folded... Now I have to reassemble my bedroom so I can sleep in my bed...
Goodnight.
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Ah, those halcyon days when I used to remember all the Shirley Temple movies vividly. Is not NOW & FOREVER, where Shirley and Coop use the term "honour bright"?
My favourite Temple song is either I LOVE TO WALK IN THE RAIN or YOU GOTTA EAT YOUR SPINACH, BABY. I have an album of Temple songs that I have not played in years.
My favourite Temple movie is probably The Little Princess or The Bachelor and The Bobby Soxer or Fort Apache...oh, and Wee Willie Winkie. Note two of those four are John Ford.
I think the stupiest moments of PC have been the Antioch "mother, may I" code which was this huge over-reaction to date rape where apparently in the course of what most people would look at as the natural course of wooing and sexual relations one was suppose to strip the entire experience of any spontaniety by turning every bit of progression into a verbal request...May I kiss you? May I unbutton your top button? May I give you a little tongue? May I unbutton your second button? May I cop a feel? etc, etc. One waggish friend of mine referred to this code of conduct as the "May I thrust again...?" laws...
In squelching any sort of social interaction or natural logical sexual curiosity...little boys in kindergarten been had laws filed against them for kissing little girls on the playground, and if not them the schools get sued, and I expect innocuous little rhymes like "I see London, I see France, I see Mary Jane's underpants" could now get a 2nd grader expelled for sexual harrassment.
The other idiocies of PC are, of course, when criminals who injure themselves while breaking into someone's house get awarded large settlements in a court of law when such lawsuits should be thrown out just on common sense long before they get to court.
And while I don't agree with President Bush that frivolous lawsuits are the cause of our medical insurance or prescription drug problems, I do agree that frivolous lawsuits are frivolous. No one should be able to sue McDonald's because they spill the coffee they ordered on themselves or because they're shoving the fast food into their faces.
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Backing up to yesterday's TOD, YES! JED! EDDIE IZZARD! How Could I forget him! And another British comic I love...the only comic I've ever gone to see live is AL MURRAY, THE PUB LANDLORD. He may be too British to translate over here, but, God, is he funny!
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DRJOSE - your first choice there is MY favorite Shirley Temple movie....she sings "On the Good Ship Lollipop" in BRIGHT EYES which also featured Jane Withers as Joy Smythe - along with James Dunn and Gloria Stuart as the love interest. Shirley's mom gets hit by a car, and Shirley goes up in plane so James can tell her the terrible news (her father had been an aviator who was killed a couple of years earlier)....James tries to tell her and Shirley realizes what has happened and asks: "You mean.....you mean....my momma cracked up?" Still makes me cry!
Shirley danced with Bill on the stairs in THE LITTLE COLONEL and also danced with him in THE LITTLEST REBEL.
And the one where she loses her father is THE LITTLE PRINCESS.
Like DR CP I like THE BACHELOR AND THE BOBBY SOXER as well among Shirley's "grown-up" roles.
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DR JOEY just sang the Lawrence Welk sign off song. I have no response to that. It was last sung on live television before he was born.
I am not a PC person - but where PC gets me the most is when it is retro-active!
I am sensitive to a point, but after that I don't argue about it - but neither do I extend or accept invitations after that. Life is too short. I can be persuaded by a genuine argument of facts, but can't be browbeaten into or out of an opinion. And I have found that most people who need to validate their own opinions by co-ercing me into agreeing with them argue thusly:
2+2 = 4 Right? Right.
1+3 = 4 Right? Right.
So then, 2 + 3 = 4. Right? WRONG!!! ;D
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DR JED & DR CP - I will add a third vote for Mr Izzard, who was also very good in SHADOW OF THE VAMPIRE.
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Thanks for Roxanne's picture DR MS. And yes DRMBARNUM I also saw her credit for HOT ROD GIRL. Actually what with the age of most of the girls in that movie, it should have more likely been called HOT ROD GRANNIES, but who would go see that?
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Scared everyone away, I did! ;D
Oh well here is your Allison Hayes picture of the week. Miss Allison on the cover of the Belgian Weekly Compain magazine in the autumn of 1954.
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Morning all! I don't know if it was your server problems, BK or the fact that I loaded a new software that helps with spyware/pop ups/etc but I couldn't get on last night.
I signed on and saw my name but I couldn't post. I messed a little with the settings on the new software so now I'm confused as to if I fixed the problem or you did. :)
Anyway, I can post again!
DR Vixmom, I would very much like that sample. Would you like to try some Empty Hats?
I have to run but hope all are doing well. I will talk with you good people tonight!
I am coming home at four thirty tonight. I've HAD it with OT.
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Good morning, all! It's 7:15 am in Manhattan, so we'll see what posting time the computer gives it. It should be 4:15 am on the West Coast.
My favorite Shirley Temple song is "I Love To Walk In The Rain." I have never seen the film it's from, but the song is great.
Shirley Temple films (none of which I've seen in the past 30 years): Heidi, Rebecca of Sunnybrook Farm, Kiss and Tell, The Bachelor and the Bobbysoxer. I've never seen The Little Princess or The Little Colonel.
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JRand really MUST stop posting his pictures of Allison Hayes, as they are politically incorrect.
And there's my own definition of PC: the fine art of taking offence where none was intended.
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We're off to get Peggy fixed. How un-PC is that? :o
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PC? Un-PC? Well, I take offense where offense is intended. But we figs (there's a reference to an old discussion on hhw!) do bandy about the fig word amonst ourselves, just as n's do the n-word. Wasn't everybody laughing hysterically at Blazing Saddles just because Mel Brooks was so grossly flaunting PC convention?
Even intended offense can be dealt with without a victim attitude. A high-school gay-rights advocate was quoted recently in the Advocate to the effect that someone had yelled "Faggot!" in the hall, to which he replied, equally loudly, "That's Mister Faggot to you!"
My Joe hates PC conventions, especially where it concerns his diasbility. I'm afraid DR Rodzinski was somewhat taken aback at the Writer's Block signing when he asked, "What do you do?" and Joe replied, "I'm a cripple."
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And speaking of the signing, I never did get a chance to publically thank BK for his wise advice to Joe. Immediately we sat down at table at Joe Allen, BK addressed Joe as to how to deal with our Neighbors from Hell most effectively. "Write a novel about them, and kill them all off!" Bravo, BK!
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As for Shirley Temple, I have a long-standing affection for Kiss and Tell. Some friends and I had gone to a Saturday double feature or something, and, unbeknownst to us, that film was on the bill along with the one we wanted to see.
It was so naughty. I mean, if you are in an Oklahoman conservative Lutheran family, Shirley's father's misconception that she is (Shh!) pregnant was terribly racy stuff.
The funniest scene is when Shirley's boyfriend Dexter Franklin (Jerome Cortland) has accidentally slapped Shirley and goes to her father (Walter Abel) to apologize. Father, of course, thinks he is refering to the other thing, and we have a string of increasingly funny doubles-entendres similarly to Tevyeh talking to the butcher about his cow/daughter.
And just imagine. That was little Shirley Temple.
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My favorite Shirley movies are "Just Around the Corner" ( I love the songs with aforementioned "I Love to Walk in the Rain," the art deco apartment building, the supporting cast including Joan Davis, Bert Lahr, Bill Robinson and Franklin Pangborn); "Poor Little Rich Girl" (with Franklin Pangborn again, I believe, Alice Faye and Jack Haley); and "Curly Top" with another great supporting cast and "Animal Crackers").
There's soemthing I like in just about every Shirley Temple movie. Shirley Temple is quite unique and could do anything. What she couldn't do well, she had the charm to get away with anyway.
"I won't grow up!
I don't wanna wear a tie,
Or a serious expression in the middle of July..."
Time to go pretend to be grown up.........
Great magazine cover, Jack!!!!
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iammyownfrenzy
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I like "Animal Crackers in My Soup". I have it on vinyl along with several other songs from her films--a record I bought from one of those TV ads (not available in any store!) in the 60's.
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The HALCYON is, of course, a sea-bird seen floating only on calm waters. Hence, the halcyon days of one's youth.
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(http://www.sterlingtimes.org/AnimalCrackers.jpg)
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I did enjoy John Goodman's short-lived TV series "Normal", but especially his Shirley Temple imitation singing, "I Like to Walk in the Rain".
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I love Shirley Temple films. My favorite is STAND UP AND CHEER, even though she has only a small part it it. Other faves are BRIGHT EYES, BABY TAKE A BOW, and THE LITTLEST REBEL.
Favorite song of Shirley's is BABY TAKE A BOW.
There is a wonderful CD set of all of the songs from Shirley's movies.
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Is it BRIGHT EYES where she sings "Oh My Goodness"? That is an amazing number where she is singing to all her dolls and switching accents depending on what doll she is singing to.
Thanks MBarnum for the Wheeler and Woolsey heads-up. Must record that.
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I am happy to report that my favorite 3 Stooges movie is coming to DVD June 28th! THE THREE STOOGES MEET HERCULES co-starring my interviewee Samson Burke as Hercules, and also co-starring the cute Vicki Trickett!
SNOW WHITE AND THE THREE STOOGES is also releasing on DVD very soon...another favorite!
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In fact Rodzinski, it looks like a whole night of Wheeler and Woolsey! There will be several W&W films that night.
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Good morning all
I was a great fan of Shirley Temple movies as a child. Back in the day, we had a fabulous little privately owned video store in Ellensburg which had all those lesser known and older titles that one cannot usually find these days. Among my favorites were -
Rebbeca Of Sunnybrook Farm
Heidi
Curly Top
Bright Eyes
My dad used to tease me mercilessly for watching those movies
Okay, off to work...
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I was writing about things that had happened on certain dates for one of our hockey publications. I wrote, "Willie O'Ree, first black man to play in the NHL" and the editor at the time changed it to "African American", even though the guy was Canadian.
What JRand calls the "retro-PC" is so annoying, like how you can't watch a lot of shows and movies from the past because they do not reflect current thinking.
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Excellent! Wheeler and Woolsey Fever! I know DIXIANA has color in it, but I'm not sure about THE CUCKOOS.
THE STERILE CUCKOO does indeed have color though.
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Hi Ann!
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One of the worst examples of "retro-PC" was Disney keeping Dumbo from distribution for years because the crows were thought to be offensive, particularly their accents. Well, the crows happen to be the hippest, most intelligent characters in the movie. But nobody seemed to notice that.
Also, the film of Porgy and Bess didn't preserve the original authentic accents used in the stage version for the same reason.
And heaven forbid we should stage The Merchant of Venice or Kiss Me, Petrucchio without holding a seminar on Shakespeare's antisemitism and "male chauvinism". That is a curious term, to say the least. How many people abbreviate it to "chauvinism" without knowing what that term means? Chauvin must be rolling in his grave.
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Jules Feiffer did a cartoon several PC cycles ago about the history of vocabulary, in sum:
"We find the term Black offensive. We wish to be called Colored."
"We find the term Colored offensive. We wish to be called Negro."
"We find the term Negro offensive. We wish to be called Black."
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Or as Pat Paulsen said, "I'm not White. I'm sort of Pink to Beige."
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My favorite Shirley Temple movie is HEIDI, and luckily for me it is available on DVD (though admittedly a slapdash, ported-from-videotape dirty transfer).
I think she gives her best performance in THE LITTLE PRINCESS and her most atypical one in THE BLUE BIRD, both of which cry out for a deserved DVD transfer from original materials. (I refuse to buy any of those public domain DVDs of THE LITTLE PRINCESS. I have a Fox authorized videotape of THE LITTLE PRINCESS, and it's spectacularly gorgeous.)
I love "You've Got to S-M-I-L-E" from STOWAWAY. As many here know, the song was used behind the main titles of MYRA BRECKINRIDGE, but seeing the originally filmed version in STOWAWAY is a joyous experience.
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There are several CD compilations of Shirley's soundtrack songs available for purchase. I also have two LPs on the Movietone label that features soundtrack songs from Shirley's films. I sometimes put them on and listen to all of them when my spirits need a lift. She's not the greatest singer in the world, but there's something about her manner and delivery that just puts a smile on my face. It's easy to see why she was the world's #1 box-office star from 1935-1938.
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Just read the VARIETY review of THE LIGHT IN THE PIAZZA. It's a very mixed review with the book by Craig Lucas getting more plaudits than Adam Guittel's "soupy, unsatisfying" music.
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DR JOEY just sang the Lawrence Welk sign off song. I have no response to that. It was last sung on live television before he was born.
PBS was always my favorite channel growing up. ;D
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They still show the Welk reruns on a lot of PBS stations too.
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One of the worst examples of "retro-PC" was Disney keeping Dumbo from distribution for years because the crows were thought to be offensive, particularly their accents. Well, the crows happen to be the hippest, most intelligent characters in the movie. But nobody seemed to notice that.
Don't forget Song of the South.
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As for Shirley Temple, I have a long-standing affection for Kiss and Tell. ...It was so naughty. I mean, if you are in an Oklahoman conservative Lutheran family, Shirley's father's misconception that she is (Shh!) pregnant was terribly racy stuff.
The funniest scene is when Shirley's boyfriend Dexter Franklin (Jerome Cortland) has accidentally slapped Shirley and goes to her father (Walter Abel) to apologize. Father, of course, thinks he is refering to the other thing, and we have a string of increasingly funny doubles-entendres similarly to Tevyeh talking to the butcher about his cow/daughter.
And just imagine. That was little Shirley Temple.
And for some reason I've now mentally got Maurice Chevalier singing "Thank Heavens For Little Girls...for little girls get bigger every day!"
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Yes, the entire situation concerning SONG OF THE SOUTH has been particularly galling for many years, all because of the PC climate that seems to vary from one movie to another.
And now that Disney's studio vaults are empty of classics (once CINDERELLA gets released this fall on DVD for the first time), the studio has now decided the film can be released with an appropriate "introduction" before the main feature.
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Good Morning!
Yeah! I actually made it out of bed before Noon! And I actually managed to book two gigs too this morning! Well, I got a call for the National Teacher Awards next week, and I got the final confirmation for my full week ofMamma Mia! here in Richmond.
Hoo and Ray!
It's another gorgeous day here in Richmond, with rain and storms predicted for tomorrow and the rest of the week. I have one load of laundry finishing up in the washer, and I'll probably put another one in, but then I think I'll take the rest of the day off. Get outside for a while. I'll take advantage of the bad weather tomorrow to take care of my packing and sorting and throwing away of various things.
-Hey, sounds like a plan to me.
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Yes, the entire situation concerning SONG OF THE SOUTH has been particularly galling for many years, all because of the PC climate that seems to vary from one movie to another.
I just found a possible glimmer of hope! http://www.jimhillmedia.com/mb/articles/showarticle.php?ID=1313 (http://www.jimhillmedia.com/mb/articles/showarticle.php?ID=1313)
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Hmmmm...
Is it white?
Is it black?
Is it gray?
???
Or is it just the Conclave of Cardinals cooking their breakfast in the Vatican?
;)
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Supposedly all the Catholic churches around the world are supposed to ring their bells when the pope is elected, but we have no bells. My suggestion was to set up the 12 inch speakers in the windows of the second floor and play a recording of bells. ::)
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...And while I don't agree with President Bush that frivolous lawsuits are the cause of our medical insurance or prescription drug problems, I do agree that frivolous lawsuits are frivolous. No one should be able to sue McDonald's because they spill the coffee they ordered on themselves or because they're shoving the fast food into their faces.
I agree with you on the latter half of your statement here, CP, but feel obligated to disagree with the first half simply due to my personal experience. Working in the Workers Compensation Insurance field as I did for over twenty years, I repeatedly saw cases where we would find that a lawyer (or team) would track down workers who had recently been laid off (most often workers who had been hired short term), send them to a doctor (another part of the team) who would put together a WC claim, and then they would sue the insurance companies. The insurance companies, rather than fight the frivolous lawsuits, would simply pay off the claims. This wouldn't have been so bad, but we're talking about hundreds of frivolous claims being paid off in this manner...which of course ended up impacting the insurance rates. Thanks to improved computer comparisons on these claims, we were able to gather enough evidence to close down some of these scams, but the effort didn't come cheap (and I personally pulled hundreds of files so that we could gather the hard copies our lawyers needed to take to court with them). This was barratry we were fighting, pure and simple...but in reality quite impure and complicated to prove as hell!
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The bells are ringing, and the smoke has shifted from black to white.
If the Vatican were located somewhere in the United States, someone would be suing them for noise and air pollution.
:-\
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It was White!
-Ring them bells!
-Could that be considered un-PC?
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I don't know about anybody else, but this Anglo-Irish-Dutch American (yeah, that's right, AIDA...make something of it!!!) has about had it with all the PC nonsense.
I'm pretty much calling things as I sees 'em these days...and PC police be damned.
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DR JRand - Thank you for the movie titles.
As for whether it was "The Littlest Rebel" or "The Littlest Colonel"....Which one dealt with a daughter wanting to marry? And maybe some bad guys trying to scheme the family out of some money?
Hmmm...
-With my luck, both movies probably had both elements.
;)
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Oh...ummm...
...good morning, everyone. :-*
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Oh...ummm...
...good morning, everyone. :-*
"everyone"? Are you being PC by using "everyone"?
;)
And I take offense at "Good Morning" since it is clearly past Noon here on the East Coast.
Harumpphhhhhhh!
;D
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Woody, I don't disagree with your findings of frivolous claims and ambulance chasing lawsuits. These are both bad and should be eliminated, of course. What I disagree with is the President's claim that these are what was running up insurance claims and medical costs. The figures during the election showed this to actually be something like one or two percent of the reason for escalating medical costs. And on the other side of that were doctors who left sponges inside people after operations. One of these people the Republicans held up as a doctor who's practice was being hurt by frivolous lawsuits when, in fact, he had had two lawsuits where he was clearly at fault and had done something in both cases exactly like the above mentioned sponge sewn in the body.
But the bottom line is that though these abuses to the system exist, they are not the main reasons behind raising medical costs and insurance.
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I too hate retro PC, particularly where movies and literature are concerned. To get upset by GONE WITH THE WIND or Bing Crosby warbling in black-face in HOLIDAY INN is just too silly. You have to judge art and culture from the proper historical perspective and not imposed today's social mores upon it. In fact, you have to judge history in the same historical perspective. It's easy to claim Columbus was some hideous monster when, in fact, he was just a creature of his time doing what what was normal in his day and age of exploration and conquest. And, of course, what is always overlook in the indictment of Columbus is that before he got here...all the Indian tribes were busy conquering each other, warring on each other, torturing each other and raping and enslaving each other.
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...I do have to say that is has been rather incredible watching the Papal "process" the past hour or so. They just started showing shots of Vatican City from the Papal Balcony... Now that's a crowd! And even more incredible to think that Vatican Square was only about 1/4 full when the smoke first started to appear.
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I too hate retro PC, particularly where movies and literature are concerned. To get upset by GONE WITH THE WIND or Bing Crosby warbling in black-face in HOLIDAY INN is just too silly. You have to judge art and culture from the proper historical perspective and not imposed today's social mores upon it. In fact, you have to judge history in the same historical perspective. ....
I know I've mentioned this here before, but...
It still amazes me the books that I was required to read in high school - a private, Catholic high school - that my friends in the public school system were not allowed to read. "Catcher in the Rye", "Tom Sawyer", etc... Even such "lighter" fare like the "Chronicles of Narnia" were put on some "questionable reading" lists due to the religious symbolism.
Hell! We even read that wonderful translation of Dante's "Inferno" that used the word "shit"! Oh, and those bawdy, bawdy "Canterbury Tales" of Chaucer. *I was never able to memorize that prologue in the Old English. ;)
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Should I modify my above post to use "sh*t"?
Or would that be too PC?
;)
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;D
Something I never thought I'd ever hear or see on TV...
"Due to the Papal Election earlier here on NBC, we will now be joining "Days of Our Lives" already in progress."
;D
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Really? Tom Sawyer now? I knew there had been a stink about Huck Finn because of its use of an epithet for Negro, which, of course, is absurd...because 1) in 1850's Missouri that's what a black man was commonly called and 2) Huck Finn happens to be one of the most humane, anti-racist books ever written...your hero's best friend is a black man who is trying to get to freedom.
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Since it is appropriate to the month, I quote from aging memory:
Whan that Aprille with his saures sots
And in the draught hath soaked to the rote
.... oops
Than longen folk to go on pilgrimages.
Remembering to trill your r's, pronounce "continental" vowels, pronounce the final e's and the gh as a gutteral, unvoiced.
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Well, my memory wasn't too terrific. Here's what I get from Projec tGutenberg.
WHEN that Aprilis, with his showers swoot,
The drought of March hath pierced to the root,
And bathed every vein in such licour,
Of which virtue engender'd is the flower;
When Zephyrus eke with his swoote breath
Inspired hath in every holt and heath
The tender croppes and the younge sun
Hath in the Ram his halfe course y-run,
And smalle fowles make melody,
That sleepen all the night with open eye,
(So pricketh them nature in their corages);
Then longe folk to go on pilgrimages,
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In our elite "advanced" English class, the teacher got special permission from the Principal to have us read, among others, Canterbury Tales, selections including all the bawdy ones, and Rabelais. So we got Chaucer, Rablais, but not Balzac.
I remember reading Macbeth from our textbook in class and our teacher becoming incensed seeing the word "wench" printed, where Shakespeare had used "whore".
In our Latin text, one of the Metamorphoses of Ovid had a footnote instructing us to "Translate this as 'his wife'", presumably so we wouldn't look up the words and find out they meant "bed partner".
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Really? Tom Sawyer now? I knew there had been a stink about Huck Finn because of its use of an epithet for Negro, which, of course, is absurd...because 1) in 1850's Missouri that's what a black man was commonly called and 2) Huck Finn happens to be one of the most humane, anti-racist books ever written...your hero's best friend is a black man who is trying to get to freedom.
At the time - and this was, WOW!, 22 years ago!! - it was a "guilt by association" thing. Since Tom and Huck were friends, and were written by the same author...
OH! And then word got out that Walt Whitman was gay!... There were some highly edited versions of "Leaves of Grass" around.
*And I still remember my Junior Year English Class with Mr. Johnson - truly one of the most lovable - and crazy - teachers I've ever had. We all came in one day...
"OK. Today we are going to start reading and analyzing the poetry of Walt Whitman. Walt Whitman was gay. Now let's read "I Hear America Singing."
-And that was all that was said about Mr. Whitman's sexual preference.
-Oh, and Mr. Johnson used to work as an orderly at St. Elizabeth's, and sometimes when we would have some free time in class he would tell some tales... Talk about non-PC!!!
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Of course in those days, when the movie came out, some newspapers insisted on printing the ad as Darn Yankees.
Later, there was one newspaper that listed Best Little Warehouse in Texas.
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Cardinal Ratzinger named new pope
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By William J. Kole
April 19, 2005 | VATICAN CITY -- Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger of Germany, a hard-line guardian of conservative doctrine, was elected the new pope Tuesday evening in the first conclave of the new millennium. He chose the name Pope Benedict XVI and called himself "a simple, humble worker."
Ratzinger, the first German pope since the 11th century, emerged onto the balcony of St. Peter's Basilica, where he waved to a wildly cheering crowd of tens of thousands and gave his first blessing as pope. Other cardinals clad in their crimson robes came out on other balconies to watch him.
"Dear brothers and sisters, after the great Pope John Paul II, the cardinals have elected me — a simple, humble worker in the vineyard of the Lord," he said. "I entrust myself to your prayers," the pope said.
The crowd responded by chanting "Benedict! Benedict!"
Ratzinger served John Paul II since 1981 as head of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith. In that position, he has disciplined church dissidents and upheld church policy against attempts by liberals for reforms. He turned 78 on Saturday.
The new pope had gone into the conclave with the most buzz among two dozen leading candidates. He had impressed many faithful with his stirring homily at the funeral of John Paul II, who died April 2 at age 84.
Okay, another hard-liner. So who was surprised? A "simple, humble worker in the vineyard" who is into discipline!
Bring back John XXIII, along with Birdie, I say.
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I'm up, I'm up.
Speaking of PC, I wonder if The Dam Busters would get shown here unedtied, since Richard Todd's dog, a jet-black large dog, is callen the "N" word - that's his name. We already know what happened to Miss Agatha Christie's book Ten Little N....s" - changed to And Then There Were None. It was changed to Ten Little Indians, but then someone found that offensive, too.
HALCYON!
I think the time stamp is still off.
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Jose, I used to have great and daring teachers like that too. The Lovely Wife and I were just talking about it the other day. My favourite teacher, Norm Yonce, advanced Senior English and Creative Writing, probably couldn't get away with the stuff he taught us back then. I remember him referring to a heroine's action in a John Steinbeck short story "as a bitch in heat". He told us that a Herrick poem entitled Advice to Young Maidens in Spring was actually entitled Advice to Young Virgins in Spring. He told us the reason that Julius Caesar is taught in high schools is not because it is one of Shakespeare's greatest plays, but because it is one of his cleanest plays. He introduced us to Rod McKuen's poetry, personally gave me William Goldman's Temple of Gold to read, and so many other things.
Teachers are so straight-jacketed by what they can do in this day and age. I find it especially sad that they are curbed from teaching anything with sexual content when the average teenager is assaulted by sexual content and imagery all day long on TV, film, and the internet...
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Happy to say that the timestamp has been adjusted and we are now with it, time-wise.
We are not with it people-wise, however, since there is nobody here but us chicken.
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I wonder if one can use the expression "There is a chink in his armour" today.
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WTO, the Vatican's Pope election of another hard-liner conservative is just another example of why the Catholic Church and Catholic religion becomes more obsolete and irrelevant everyday. Everyone else is moving into the 21st century, while the Catholic hierarchy keeps retreating back to the 12th century.
Of course, it doesn't help that the entire hierarchy is a bunch of geezer, decrepit old men who have never been laid...at least as far as we all know.
There was an episode of South Park a year or so ago which brilliantly punctured the archiac institution of the Catholic hierarchy.
Of course, putting it all in historical perspective, one has to remember that around the time of Constantine, The Church held conventions to decide just how to cobble the whole Christian religion together...and cobbled it was...from deciding which gospels would be included as "The Revealed Word of God", to appropriating pagan holidays and making them Christian holidays (the pagan god Mithras was born on December 25th), to deciding to gut any feminine aspect of the religion. They stole bits from this religion and bits from that religion and jostled it altogether in a great big conical hat and came up with Christianity. When you examine it from an historical viewpoint, it sounds just as fantastical and improbable as any "pagan" religion.
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And even Mr. Kevin Spirtas had a moment of PC - he was wondering if it would be acceptable to sing Thank Heaven for Little Girls. Such silliness.
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"everyone"? Are you being PC by using "everyone"?
;)
And I take offense at "Good Morning" since it is clearly past Noon here on the East Coast.
Harumpphhhhhhh!
;D
:PThwrttttsszztts! :P
:-*
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WTO, the Vatican's Pope election of another hard-liner conservative is just another example of why the Catholic Church and Catholic religion becomes more obsolete and irrelevant everyday. Everyone else is moving into the 21st century, while the Catholic hierarchy keeps retreating back to the 12th century.
True enough, IMO.
But...the man is 77 and looks 87.
My guess is we'll be going through this process again within the next 10 years or less (maybe even 5). Makes me think they deliberately chose a man who would make no changes for a while, until they get a feel for how a "healthy" pope with views similar to JPII will fare in the 21s century.
Who gets elected next may welll depend on how this one does with the little time he has left.
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And even Mr. Kevin Spirtas had a moment of PC - he was wondering if it would be acceptable to sing Thank Heaven for Little Girls. Such silliness.
As long as Mr. Michael Jackson doesn't sing "Thank Heaven for Little Boys."
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Many of the people who work at the church where I live were not very happy with his election. Most of us were hoping for either the Cardinal from Nigeria or one of the Cardinals from Latin America. I still have hope that they will be tired of having a hardliner and go for someone more liberal next time.
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WTO, the Vatican's Pope election ...
When you examine it from an historical viewpoint, it sounds just as fantastical and improbable as any "pagan" religion.
Frist First, let me thank you for promoting me to Executive Producer at Warner Bros. ...
Can you imagine the sandled carpenter coming to the Vatican and taking a look at the architecture, the costumes, the rituals, and the politics? Oy!
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The first thing he'd say: "That pagan idol is supposed to be my mother? She doesn't even look Jewish."
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As for the new Pope...
Being a born and raised Roman Catholic, I didn't really expect that anyone "radical" would be elected to the Papal Throne. And it's been sort of "fun" reading the spin that's already appeared in the past hour or so about people complaining that such a "hardliner" had been elected. Was there every really a chance that someone progressive would have gotten elected? Even the progressive Cardinal candidates are really not that progressive.
Yes, I do find faults with the Catholic Church and with some of it's doctrines, but I do have to admire their relative steadfastness and "moral continuity"
The thing to watch over the next couple of years - well, many, many, many years - is whether or not the "American Catholic Church" will become a separate entity.
Can you say "schism"?
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Where were we? Oh, that's right... Shirley Temple.
;)
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Hmmm.. Clean sheets!
:)
And on that note, I shall put on one of my Old Navy t-shirts - don't you just love disposable clothing? - and a pair of shorts - if I can find a pair that fits! - which is a good thing. :) and then head out and wander aimlessly about for a bit. The clouds are starting to move in and the humidity is too.
OH! And I need to buy the winning MegaMillions Lottery ticket while I'm out.
:D
Laters...
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WFO, Sorry about that middle initial...I've just watched too many episodes of Cheyenne. I know it's an "F" and I keep thinking I'm typing an "F", but my fingers are ignorant cusses.
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Of course, it doesn't help that the entire hierarchy is a bunch of geezer, decrepit old men who have never been laid...at least as far as we all know.
Oh, did I just read on the news that there were a series of lightning strikes just reported in Los Feliz?
;)
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If lightning strikes...I hope it hits that hypocrite egoist Cardinal Mahoney's monument to himself cathedral downtown.
Joey, they may not have to wait too long before they do this again...given that this geezer is 78!
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Where were we? Oh, that's right... Shirley Temple.
;)
That's right. Even though you were raised a Catholic, we are now worshiping at the Shirley Temple.
(Remember the rules! No groaning!)
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HALCYON!
-
Halcy on, Dude!
-
Halcy on, Nurse!
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Good Vibrations has been washed out. News at Playbill On-Line
http://www.playbill.com/news/article/92444.html
Also, the last remaining HoJo (Howard Johnson) restaurant in Times Square will close sometime later this summer. It will be torn down (along with the Gaiety Male Dance Emporium which just closed) to make room for something we desperately need in Times Square, a multi-level shining glass shopping emporium.
That story is at Playbill On-Line as well.
I wonder if the small theatre which houses Perfect Crime (it's right next to the HoJo) will be torn down as well. If so, maybe that show will finally close. It's been running for 21 years. It started in 1984 at the small space in the Promenade Theatre at 76th and Broadway and then moved into midtown. I saw it when it first opened and was amazed at how truly awful it was. What do I know? 21 years later the turkey is still running. If you come to New York, RUN from this show. It's one of the stinkers of all time (in my humble opinion, of course).
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I too hate retro PC, particularly where movies and literature are concerned. To get upset by GONE WITH THE WIND or Bing Crosby warbling in black-face in HOLIDAY INN is just too silly. You have to judge art and culture from the proper historical perspective and not imposed today's social mores upon it. In fact, you have to judge history in the same historical perspective. It's easy to claim Columbus was some hideous monster when, in fact, he was just a creature of his time doing what what was normal in his day and age of exploration and conquest. And, of course, what is always overlook in the indictment of Columbus is that before he got here...all the Indian tribes were busy conquering each other, warring on each other, torturing each other and raping and enslaving each other.
I so totally agree!
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LOL WFO!! ;D
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I am the lucky recipient of a free ticket to Forbidden Broadway Special Victims Unit! A friend had them and cannot attend so I will go in her place.
It's turning into a theatre week after all. Didn't expect it after last week's marathon but I'm seeing FB tonight, Wednesday is Steel Magnolias (also for free since a friend knows one of the producers), Thursday is Sweet Charity with Miss Applegate and Sunday afternoon is Virginia Woolf.
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I was wondering what all of those bells ringing outside was all about!
Personally, I have been reading up on Hinduism and Buddhism (thanks to some books I found at an estate sale).
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It was White!
-Ring them bells!
-Could that be considered un-PC?
Only if it's "Ring dem bells!"
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We're back from our idyllic few days at the coast. It was truly stunning there--perfect weather. We even saw a Double Rainbow (DR Joey, if you haven't heard it yet, get Jobim's song of the same name, which was released in English at the same time as Waters of March, though it was originally written as an instrumental for the soundtrack to The Adventurers).
TOD which synchronistically (that's a word, isn't it?) touches on my trip to the coast: Regarding Song of the South, I think I posted here several months ago that Leonard Maltin, who contacted me about my Frances Farmer article, indicated that it was indeed in the DVD works and has been for some time. Mr. Maltin had a long e-discourse about PC-ness in film, specifically in relationship to the Farmer/Barrymore film World Premiere, which had several (to me, anyway) inexplicable cuts made through the years. Mr. Maltin made it quite clear that he is as frustrated as any of us over Disney's refusal to let the film and its milieu (sp?) speak for itself.
Anyway, here's a little trivia regarding World Premiere that maybe one of you film scholars can answer for me: I was channel surfing at our timeshare at the coast, because they have cable (which we don't at home, luddites that we are). I caught the last five or so minutes of the W.C. Fields film Never Give a Sucker an Even Break, which I had never seen before. Well imagine my surprise when the credits began to roll, the underscore was the same as the credits underscore for World Premiere. This strikes me as very strange, as Sucker was a Universal release and WP a Paramount. I looked on IMDb and Sucker was scored by Frank Skinner and Charles Previn. I'm thinking Skinner might have scored WP (the music credits aren't on IMDb, and I can't remember right now), so maybe he was able to use this same music for two films.
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The little Catholic church in Seaside let off a column of white smoke this morning. The kids saw it and we didn't put two and two together until we turned on the news.
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DR JRand - Thank you for the movie titles.
As for whether it was "The Littlest Rebel" or "The Littlest Colonel"....Which one dealt with a daughter wanting to marry? And maybe some bad guys trying to scheme the family out of some money?
That's THE LITTLE COLONEL which contained the first Technicolor images of Shirley ever filmed. A Technicolor sequence was filmed and tacked on to the end of the film which I saw for the first time when I bought the Fox videotape release of THE LITTLE COLONEL.
Lionel Barrymore was the father who didn't like his daughter marrying a Yankee.
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The little Catholic church in Seaside let off a column of white smoke this morning. The kids saw it and we didn't put two and two together until we turned on the news.
The priests and the nuns were sharing a toke together? :o
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Spent some time this afternoon getting reacquainted with the excellent fantasy series ANGEL. I watched the first season DVD set a few months ago, and then decided I wouldn't overdose on them but let it rest for awhile. Today, I finally started Season 2, and the angst mixed with tongue-in-cheek comedy and horror elements is as strong and enjoyable as ever. Looking forward to watching these episodes spread out over the next few weeks or so.
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Peggy is back from the vet's already, a bit groggy and sore but glad to be home again.
Why do they call it "fixed" when she clearly feels broken right now?
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The priests and the nuns were sharing a toke together? :o
That is completely un-PC. That stated, had I known that was going on, I might have needed to take a little walk this morning.... ;)
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Whilst der Brucer was at the-store-some-people-cannot-hear-the-name-of-without-having-a-screaming-fit, buying bird seed and corn for the squirrels, I checked to see whether or not L'il Abner was on their DVD shelves yet. It was not.
Then again, in my area of the country they might have trouble figuring out whether the film is supposed to be a musical or a biography.
8)
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Seems slow around here. Will John Barrowman liven things up?
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Sorry I wasn't around DRJOSE - but DR MATTH has posted the correct answer. And yes, Shirley is in color for the last few minutes of the film.
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A wonderful package arrived today from amazon uk - Special Editions of Fistful of Dollars, For a Few Dollars More and A Fistful of Dynamite (aka Duck, You Sucker). I'm already perusing Fistful of Dollars, and it looks pretty great despite a couple of weirdnesses with the element used for the transfer. We do love these movies and I'm really looking forward to all the extras, too.
Other good news - I booked a haircut and was lucky that the very busy Teddy could see me today. Also, booked a massage and was lucky that the very busy Marina could see me tonight.
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Depress-o-vision department: we just found out the elderly couple next to us with the farmhouse on 9/10 acre sold to a developer. The good news is he can only put in one more house, since we're in an environmentally protected zone. The bad news is the driveway to said house will probably run next to our property. The good news is there is plenty of screening, including the world's largest laurel hedge (probably at least 50 ft. high, I kid you not) on our property. The other good news is this leaves our property (2/3+ of an acre) as the one remaining large lot in the neighborhood, which should significantly boost our property value.
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Miss Allison Hayes does not know the MEANING of the term "politically correct."
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It's easy to claim Columbus was some hideous monster when, in fact, he was just a creature of his time doing what what was normal in his day and age of exploration and conquest. And, of course, what is always overlook in the indictment of Columbus is that before he got here...all the Indian tribes were busy conquering each other, warring on each other, torturing each other and raping and enslaving each other.
Right! And I guess Hitler was just a true-blue Aryan of his time doing what he thought was best.
I've read some rubbish in odd places, but I never thought I'd read anything like this here at Haines His Way.
And I guess your comment would lend itself to apologizing for the slave trade, too, since all the Africans were doing were warring on one another. Serves 'em right, didn't it!
What crap!
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DR JMK - thanks for the cd's and the beautiful FF photo that arrived yesterday!
Maybe that "exit" music from SUCKER and PREMIERE was just stock music that MCA used for the television versions of their Universal and Paramount pictures. Who knows? The same music had been used at the wrap up of THE BANK DICK which had just previously been shown on TCM.
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THE LITTLEST REBEL is Shirley and her COnfederate soldier father on the run from the Yankees, and her begging Abraham Lincoln to pardon her father. Not one of my favorites, but she does more good dancing in it with Bojangles Robinson.
I do like CAPTAIN JANUARY ("At the Codfish Ball").
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DR JMK - thanks for the cd's and the beautiful FF photo that arrived yesterday!
Maybe that "exit" music from SUCKER and PREMIERE was just stock music that MCA used for the television versions of their Universal and Paramount pictures. Who knows? The same music had been used at the wrap up of THE BANK DICK which had just previously been shown on TCM.
Except that I'm pretty sure that same exit music is on the "archival print" of World Premiere that I have, that is not the MCA-TV licensed version. Otherwise, yes, that makes perfect sense--I had forgotten the MCA connection.
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Off for the rest of today to various giggage. It's tech week at Pajama Game. With high schoolers. May I just say, Oy?
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Other good news - I booked a haircut and was lucky that the very busy Teddy could see me today. Also, booked a massage and was lucky that the very busy Marina could see me tonight.
Teddy today, Marina tonight...you flirt!
8)
HALCYON!
-
On this day in 1933 Jayne Mansfield was born. American beauty contest winner, stage and screen actress. Supposedly the only title she ever turned down was 'Miss Roquefort Cheese,' because she believed it "just didn't sound right."
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DR JMK - is your WP archival print a 16 mm?
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Jayne & Mickey Page Five Dance! ;D
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Sounds like MRBK is getting The Works today!
DRJOSE don't forget to check the MAMMA MIA! rag bag for a couple of your friends!
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If there is a difference of opinion, no matter how impassioned, please present it calmly. Thank you.
HACYON, baby, HALCYON!
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I too hate retro PC, particularly where movies and literature are concerned. To get upset by GONE WITH THE WIND or Bing Crosby warbling in black-face in HOLIDAY INN is just too silly. You have to judge art and culture from the proper historical perspective and not imposed today's social mores upon it. In fact, you have to judge history in the same historical perspective. It's easy to claim Columbus was some hideous monster when, in fact, he was just a creature of his time doing what what was normal in his day and age of exploration and conquest. And, of course, what is always overlook in the indictment of Columbus is that before he got here...all the Indian tribes were busy conquering each other, warring on each other, torturing each other and raping and enslaving each other.
DRPogue, I agree with you as well. I never thought of Columbus as a monster, although I do have problems with the whole 15th-16th Century "Age of Discovery" attitude of white supremacy. However, I do agree with Robert Darnton in THE GREAT CAT MASSACRE that history has to be judged in the proper perspective: attitudes of 1492 are not the attitudes of today, and an 18th century act like the cat massacre is completely un-PC today. Darnton's chapter on Bruno Bettelheim's attempt to psychoanalyze folktales from an era in which dire poverty, cruel fates, horrifying wars, etc. led to orphans, starvation, child abuse, possible cannibalism is quite illuminating.
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Off the topics totally. What's new.
I could not log on to HHW last night (OZtime). My password was not accepted. It's OK today. Very odd.
Last nights viewing here was "Athena". For some reason I thought that Michael Barnum should be watching it.
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Last nights viewing here was "Athena". For some reason I thought that Michael Barnum should be watching it.
Doesn't he own it?
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Good Afternoon!
Back from my walk. I ended up just walking... and walking... and walking... I was out almost three hours! I walked up and down Carytown, then up to VCU, then zig-zagged back through the Fan back to my apartment.
A very nice day for a walk, and it actually felt a little "hot" - I think we hit 83 here today.
I went ahead and took another disposable camera with me and snapped photos of some of my personal landmarks. Places I'll miss. -And, yes, most of them were/are restaurants. ;)
I almost took pics of some people - business owners, restaurant cooks, etc.- but as soon as I started thinking about those people, I knew I would start crying. So, I just took pics of their businesses. I will always know and remember their faces in my mind's eye.
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Doesn't he own it?
:) I hope so.
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Ohhh... From the so cute and endearing department...
I was just chatting with my friend, Andy. He mentioned that he saw a truly attractive man today at work. He said his heart stopped he was so beautiful. But my favorite comment was:
"I was embarassed of the shoes i was wearing."
Awwwww....
;)
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DRPogue, I agree with you as well. I never thought of Columbus as a monster, although I do have problems with the whole 15th-16th Century "Age of Discovery" attitude of white supremacy. However, I do agree with Robert Darnton in THE GREAT CAT MASSACRE that history has to be judged in the proper perspective: attitudes of 1492 are not the attitudes of today, and an 18th century act like the cat massacre is completely un-PC today. Darnton's chapter on Bruno Bettelheim's attempt to psychoanalyze folktales from an era in which dire poverty, cruel fates, horrifying wars, etc. led to orphans, starvation, child abuse, possible cannibalism is quite illuminating.
Ohhhh, well then...and by that standard, I suppose the mindset of the modern Muslim extremist being what it is, based on his culture and his perspective makes such acts as the 9/11 attacks forgivable.
After all, that's how they were raised and taught...
All things are forgivable, regardless.... ?
Somehow, though, I'm sure the argument is that the acts of extremists today are not in line with what "we" consider acceptable behavior for the 21st Century. Amazing, isn't it that they don't see it that way....
So the Spanish were right...and, therefore, the slave-traders were obviously right...but...was the Third Reich right, too, given the centuries of northern European hatred for the Jews???...within the very narrow confines of the argument at hand.
I guess you good old boys are right, then!!
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Evening all! I told you I'd be home early tonight!
I told the people at work that just one month ago today, I was in the company of three very dashing and wonderful men as they took me on a wonderful day long tour of NYC music shops. I also told them that today did NOT equal that day in any way, shape or form. So my boss said we would all go out for pizza tomorrow! :) How about that?
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Ohhhh, well then...and by that standard, I suppose the mindset of the modern Muslim extremist being what it is, based on his culture and his perspective makes such acts as the 9/11 attacks forgivable.
After all, that's how they were raised and taught...
All things are forgivable, regardless....
DRRonPulliam, no, the acts are unforgivable, even if you're spoiling for a fight tonight.
My point is that Pogue is right that different mindsets occur at different points in history; for all I know, your great-great-great grandparents and mine could have been slave owners. I don't know that mine weren't, and while that could be something un-PC in the family tree today, it wasn't considered inappropriate for the time or the culture. We like to think we're cultivated, educated, high on the environmental structure, but we still produce monsters like Hitler and Ted Bundy and Jeffrey Dahlmer. The difference between those gentlemen and the extremists responsible for 9/11 is that we like to think we're 21st-century minds confronting folk whose minds are still in the 15th Century.
My favorite composer Mozart probably bathed, if ever, maybe twice a year, the French court of Versailles had lice, during the Reign of Terror the guillotine was a source of popular entertainment, in 1915 Leo Frank was lynched by a bunch of "do-gooders," whose descendants may have fought the civil rights movement in the 1960s. We haven't evolved so far as we like to think. I hope my attitudes in the next 100 years will be judged as a part of its time and culture.
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We have POPE! Things might get hopeless at times but we can't be Popeless.
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The opening sentence of THE GO-BETWEEN:
"The past is a foreign country; they do things differently there."
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DRRonPulliam, no, the acts are unforgivable, even if you're spoiling for a fight tonight.
My point is that Pogue is right that different mindsets occur at different points in history; for all I know, your great-great-great grandparents and mine could have been slave owners. I don't know that mine weren't, and while that could be something un-PC in the family tree today, it wasn't considered inappropriate for the time or the culture. We like to think we're cultivated, educated, high on the environmental structure, but we still produce monsters like Hitler and Ted Bundy and Jeffrey Dahlmer. The difference between those gentlemen and the extremists responsible for 9/11 is that we like to think we're 21st-century minds confronting folk whose minds are still in the 15th Century.
My favorite composer Mozart probably bathed, if ever, maybe twice a year, the French court of Versailles had lice, during the Reign of Terror the guillotine was a source of popular entertainment, in 1915 Leo Frank was lynched by a bunch of "do-gooders," whose descendants may have fought the civil rights movement in the 1960s. We haven't evolved so far as we like to think. I hope my attitudes in the next 100 years will be judged as a part of its time and culture.
I get that. I do. And I know that perspective is essential to properly judge history.
However, the idea that "ALL" Native Americans were savagely warring with one another and enslaving one another and raping one another is totally wrong.
Totally wrong.
And saying Columbus and his men should not be vilified for their abuse and misconduct of the friendly natives they encountered is totally wrong.
They were supposedly "Christian" men. Being a Christian in 1492 meant pretty much the same thing as being a Christian in 2005. Murder and stealing were sins. Murder was a mortal sin.
Catholic priests accompanied those Spaniards...and apparently condoned the barbarism because the Natives worshipped different gods.
I may be overreacting, Larry....and Charles...and if I've done so, I'm sorry.
I don't want to fight. But I also can't NOT argue about some of the comments being proferred...regardless of the time and their ways...it was certainly wrong by "our" standards. It was also wrong by the standards of the native American peoples. And it was most certainly wrong by the standards of Christianity.
Greed for gold and that very peculiar brand of Spanish sadism that made all means toward an end acceptable were not the norm for the rest of the world.
IMO, of course.
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I just heard on the news about the ten year old that killed his mother and then himself. Sigh. He left a note saying that he was sorry.
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So what do you suppose Allison WOULD make of all of this?
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Mr Errol Flynn at the END of his Halcyon Days at Warner Bros will be on TCM tonight in 1948's THE ADVENTURES OF DON JUAN. I like this movie, so I will be watching.
It features the mother of CP's neighbor Kris Tabori - Miss Viveca Lindfors.
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For DRs Jennifer, RLP and MAtt et al
How the choice was made...
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For DRs Jennifer, RLP and MAtt et al
How the choice was made...
WWSS?*
(What Would Simon Say?) :) ;)
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Mr Errol Flynn at the END of his Halcyon Days at Warner Bros will be on TCM tonight in 1948's THE ADVENTURES OF DON JUAN. I like this movie, so I will be watching.
It features the mother of CP's neighbor Kris Tabori - Miss Viveca Lindfors.
I LOVED Don Juan! What time?
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I get that. I do. And I know that perspective is essential to properly judge history.
However, the idea that "ALL" Native Americans were savagely warring with one another and enslaving one another and raping one another is totally wrong.
Totally wrong.
And saying Columbus and his men should not be vilified for their abuse and misconduct of the friendly natives they encountered is totally wrong.
They were supposedly "Christian" men. Being a Christian in 1492 meant pretty much the same thing as being a Christian in 2005. Murder and stealing were sins. Murder was a mortal sin.
Catholic priests accompanied those Spaniards...and apparently condoned the barbarism because the Natives worshipped different gods.
I may be overreacting, Larry....and Charles...and if I've done so, I'm sorry.
I don't want to fight. But I also can't NOT argue about some of the comments being proferred...regardless of the time and their ways...it was certainly wrong by "our" standards. It was also wrong by the standards of the native American peoples. And it was most certainly wrong by the standards of Christianity.
Greed for gold and that very peculiar brand of Spanish sadism that made all means toward an end acceptable were not the norm for the rest of the world.
IMO, of course.
DRRonPulliam, the Catholic Church and its policies toward infidels, from the Crusades to the Inquisition to Pope Pius' overlooking the Nazi atrocities, still boggle my mind. Clearly, at that time and place Christianity was a white supremist paradise, and wiping out or converting the heathen was God's intention.
I don't think the Spaniards were the only guilty ones, however; Elizabethan England may have produced Shakespeare, but Elizabeth's father used politics to kill several women. The slave trade in the Indies kept the landed gentry wealthy from their plantations, and Jane Austen's "good" characters think nothing of it. I'm sure the French and Dutch were equally cruel in their territories. God knows in Europe alone the Hundred Years' War, the Thirty Years War, and the "liberation" of Napoleon's armies were filled with rape, public execution, and atrocity. All done by "Christian" men, often in the name of God.
I'm enjoying the debate. Apology accepted.
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So what do you suppose Allison WOULD make of all of this?
She would probably wonder when she'd have sex with the right person to make her a star.
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BK: Is a fistful of dynamite the complete restored version or the cut version they showed in the USA? I remember seeing the uncut in Montreal serveral times. I think it played three years at a small theater near my house.
158 min / Italy:162 min (restored version) / USA:120 min (initial US release) / USA:138 min / USA:154 min (Laserdisc version)
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I watched "The Mission" a few weeks ago. Nothing has changed. The unholy trinity of Church, State and Commerce still "slaughter" the innocents in the quest for power.
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We've had "Seussical, The Musical" and now we have "Newsical, the Musical".
How long before we get "J'Accusical, the Musical"??????
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8 pm EST on TCM - DRDANISE. Less than one hour.
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She would probably wonder when she'd have sex with the right person to make her a star.
DR ELMORE! Miss Mary Jane was a good Catholic girl who would NEVER consider anything like that. She stayed home nights reading books on politics and practicing the piano.
She might have been a bigger star if she hadn't been so nice. ;D
As Mara Corday said: "She was a nice girl without a jealous bone in her body."
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Well, I might get to see part of it.
Got to run.
Laters, all!
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We've had "Seussical, The Musical" and now we have "Newsical, the Musical".
How long before we get "J'Accusical, the Musical"??????
I actually saw a workshop of a musical called "That Scoundrel Dreyfus"; does that count?
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DR ELMORE! Miss Mary Jane was a good Catholic girl who would NEVER consider anything like that. She stayed home nights reading books on politics and practicing the piano.
She might have been a bigger star if she hadn't been so nice. ;D
As Mara Corday said: "She was a nice girl without a jealous bone in her body."
DRJRand54, I knew I'd get a rise out of you! You made my day! ;D
I have to tape the REEFEER MADNESS for you this week.
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PAGE 6 DANCE!!!!
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Danise enjoy your pizza tomorrow while I am on my way to Portland. :)
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Wasn't there an Allison Hayes film NURSE JANE HITS PORTLAND?
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LOL - NO!! However she did play a para-nurse who took a dive out of a helicopter on RIPCORD with Mr Dash Riprock himself.
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DRPogue, I agree with you as well. I never thought of Columbus as a monster, although I do have problems with the whole 15th-16th Century "Age of Discovery" attitude of white supremacy. However, I do agree with Robert Darnton in THE GREAT CAT MASSACRE that history has to be judged in the proper perspective: attitudes of 1492 are not the attitudes of today, and an 18th century act like the cat massacre is completely un-PC today.
Well put, DR Elmore. I think, before some of my favorite Dear Readers have to rush off and take a cold shower, it should be pointed out that understanding people's actions in a historical context helps to explain them, but not necessarily to excuse them.
One thing that I did not like about Roots was that everybody in the slave-holding families was without exception a rotter. Even poor Sandy Duncan, who started out with some humanity in her, became cold and evil. I do not believe that the slave-holders were totally devoid of humanity where their slaves were concerned. It's well enough for us to judge a White who grew up on a plantation and insist that he should have freed all his slaves and given away his family's fortune out of contempt for the system. But put us in the same situation, and how many would have the courage?
We now return you to your regularly scheduled frivolity.
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The Amazing Race is on tonight as well!
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I just got here myself.
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GOOD VIBES for DR JMK at his high school dress rehearsal for THE PAJAMA GAME.....
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For those who were taking part in the discourse, thank you for keeping it reasoned and respectful.
I'm back. Teddy made me look wonderful. I also heard about the latest trend (now in the UK, but no doubt on its way here) - this latest trend (fad) is called doggin
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Dogging.
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This new fad, dogging, is people, YOUNG people, having exhibitionist sex in groups in public places. Ain't life grand. It's perfectly in keeping with the world we live in.
For anyone who had weirdnesses late last night on the site - there was some host problem and we were down for a few minutes and when we came up the timestamp had reverted to pre-daylight savings time. All is well now.
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The new SE of Fistful of Dynamite is uncut - on the UK version only, a few seconds of violence to animals is missing, because the UK has a censorship law about that - they'll be in the US version.
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Good Evening!
I splurged on dinner again tonight - calorically, not financially - fried chicken livers and fried rice. Yum! Yum!
Now I'm watching "American Idol". It's Disco night. And so far, so good. A very fun evening tonight. And NO ballads! :)
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Well... There was one performance/performer that had me cringing almost every five seconds... Ah, well...
But still a fun show. Tomorrow night will be interesting.
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DR JOSE don't forget the Mamma Mia! rag bag!
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Dogging?
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For some reason, DR Jose's avatar is not showing up on any pages here this eveneing, but everyone else's is.
Jose, did your avatar run out for a sandwich?
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Good Evening!
I splurged on dinner again tonight - calorically, not financially - fried chicken livers and fried rice. Yum! Yum!
Now I'm watching "American Idol". It's Disco night. And so far, so good. A very fun evening tonight. And NO ballads! :)
DRJose, where's your avatar?
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DR JOSE don't forget the Mamma Mia! rag bag!
I won't. I won't.
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For some reason, DR Jose's avatar is not showing up on any pages here this eveneing, but everyone else's is.
Jose, did your avatar run out for a sandwich?
I dunno?
It disappeared the other day too for a while.
???
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DRJose, where's your avatar?
I dunno?
It disappeared the other day too for a while.
???
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This new fad, dogging, is people, YOUNG people, having exhibitionist sex in groups in public places. Ain't life grand. It's perfectly in keeping with the world we live in.
Oh, no! It was already hard enough to get them to move out of the way when you're walking down the street. Now it will be impossible. And I suppose they'll be chatting on their cell phones at the same time.
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Is there an echo in here?
-Well, at least there's that since my avatar has gone away.
???
Maybe that's a sign I'm supposed to put a new one up.
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Oh, no! It was already hard enough to get them to move out of the way when you're walking down the street. Now it will be impossible. And I suppose they'll be chatting on their cell phones at the same time.
That and broadcasting it to the web via their cellphones.
All together now!
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But I see you didn't actually download your avatar. Rather, you linked to a picture on aol-members. Perhaps the problem is at aol?
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The Man Without An Avatar
That will be the name of my next novel.
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Oh, and there I did it. I complain about people who confuse download with upload. I meant, of course, upload. Next thing, I'll be talking about Broadway Soundtrack Albums!
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But what will their kids be able to do to shock their parents?
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But I see you didn't actually download your avatar. Rather, you linked to a picture on aol-members. Perhaps the problem is at aol?
Hmm... I thought I actually uploaded the pic here.. Hmmm...
Let me see...
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The Case of the Missing Avatar
That will be the name of my new mystery novel.
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Ron, elmore and WFO have answered eloquently and I would hope similarly to what I would have answered. No, maybe not all Indians engaged in the brutal conquests of their neighbours, but many, many tribes did and it's just as misguided to think everyone over here was living in an idyllic Eden-like paradise before the white Europeans came. After all, the Aztecs were indulging in human sacrifice and ripping the hearts out of their victims.
What Muslim fanatics are doing is inexcusable precisely because they are still living in a 12th century mindset whereas the rest of the world has moved on.
And I've already taken my swipes at the mindset of the Catholic hierarchy today, so don't get me started there again. Though I will say that the Catholic priests burning of the Mayan writings I consider one of the great tragedies of the world along with the burning of the library in Alexandria.
What I hate is when we judge extraordinary albeit flawed men by today's standards and try to make it all or nothing and turn them into pariahs and then minimize their extraordinary feats and achievements...people like Columbus, Caesar, Jefferson come to mind.
Another PC thing that bothers me is all the mea culpa that governments try to do for the past sins of history...despite the fact that no one from those previous countries or governments are still living. I can see a valid point for paying reparations to actual victims of something like the Holocaust or our own interment of Japanese citizens, but when we start wanting to pay reparations for slavery when none of those people are still alive or apologize for the Crusades or Galilelo or whatever, then I think it starts to get a little ridiculous. None of us are responsible for the sins of our fathers or fore-fathers.
It's about how we conduct ourselves now. Not about a bunch of people who are dead and gone and we never knew. That's history...and if we start paying for the sins of history where does it stop and who gets the blame? Especially when the borders and the governments and the people are always shifting and moving and changing. It's really time for a lot of people to stop playing the victim card over what happened a hundred, two hundred, 500 hundred years ago and just get on with their life. I get real tired of hearing: "If you hadn't done this to my ancestors, I might be better off. " And maybe you'd be worse off, living in a loincloth starving in some war-torn country or maybe not even born because the chain of events that led to your great-great-great- great granny meeting your great-great-great great grandpop might never have happened.
So unless you're a living victim who was personally affected by some historical grievance within the last hundred years, just stop whinging, sucked it up, and get on with your life.
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Avatar, Dearest
That will be the name...
-Yeah, yeah, yeah...the joke is old already.
;)
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Frivolous Lawsuits:
For about six years, my Joe was involved in a (nonfrivolous) lawsuit against the company that poisoned him.
During that time, we were acutely aware of other suits in the news. Among them, of course, the lady who spilled hot coffee in her lap.
But the corker was the secretary who was suing a law firm she had worked for for sexual harrassment. Her main contention appeared to be that the president of the firm had squeezed her breasts.
Eventually she settled out of court--for seven million dollars! That's seven-zero-zero-zero-zero-zero-zero dollars, U period S period! And Joe got a fraction of that for being crippled for life with "the most painful of all rheumatic diseases" according to an acknowledged expert in rheumatology.
I'm sure ninety percent of all women who read about that screamed, "Squeeze mine! Please!" Joe certainly did.
But we all know that the settlement was not for the squeezing of the breasts, don't we? She had worked for several years for a major law firm. She must have known where a lot of bodies were buried.
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I was reading a book the other day. . .
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I just got back from a fun evening in the theatre. I was originally supposed to have two tickets to this folderol but wires were crossed and I only had one. Lucky me that I found out before I made phone calls asking anyone (except one person, you know who you are, so it's good you couldn't go after all) if they would like to attend with me. Ah, well.
Back to the theatre. I saw Forbidden Broadway, SVU! Funny, funny show. I laughed and laughed even though the audience was a bit slow and not laughing as much. A couple of times I stifled my laughter because others were not laughing but then I thought, why should I let them interrupt my good time and I laughed loud and long. There is no rundown in the program and I don't remember every take off but there was a great Bernadette Peters Gypsy take off and a VERY funny Fiddler/British directors bit. BK, Jennifer Simard is in the show. She lists Unsung Musicals III, Sondheim at the Movies and I Love You, You're Perfect, Now Change in her credits. Even though it's not Wednesday, do you remember her. She was very good. And now, it's off to bed. Catch up with you tomorrow.
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I'm back!
:D
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I'm back!
:D
At this performance the role of Jose Simbulan will be played by . . .
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Lovely NEW JOSE avatar.
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Good to see you back where you belong DR Jose.
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DR td - did you enjoy it?
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Very exciting AMAZING RACE tonight. We are down to four teams.
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At this performance the role of Jose Simbulan will be played by . . .
Rodzinski
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I'm back from supping with Miss Tammy Minoff. She'd asked me to go with her to look at a car she was thinking of buying. Neither of us liked the seller, and I thought the car smelled like someone had eaten sheep's eyeballs in it, so it's a pass. We dined at Marie Callendar's, where I had the bacon cheeseburger, a salad, and no ranch dressing.
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And now, Marina the Masseuse has arrived, so I will be on a table for the next hour or so. Keep the home fries burning until my returning.
I wish I hadn't just eaten that cheeseburger so close to the massage.
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I was reading a book the other day. . .
Was it about a whale?
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It's nice to see DR Jose out from behind that keyboard and enjoying himself on the streets of...?
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DR Michael Shayne - Sssshhhhhh.....
:-X
DR elmore will get jealous...
:-*
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It's nice to see DR Jose out from behind that keyboard and enjoying himself on the streets of...?
...Washington, DC, in front of the National Building Museum.
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DR TomovOz, that "Pope Idol" pic was hysterical.
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DR Jose, I like the new avatar.
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Re: All The Pope Talk today...
Has anyone heard of the Prophecy of St. Malachy? Most theologians hold it to be a hoax, but so far they have been able to connect each coded title in the prophecy with every Pope in some way. http://www.catholic-pages.com/grabbag/malachy.asp
I thought it was interesting in a Wizard of Oz/Dark Side of the Moon sort of way.
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As long as we are talking PC and un-PC, I must share with you a rather long piece which was posted on sondheim.com for a while and drew comments from the offended.
I'M ILLITERATE
Stephen Sondheim has opined in various forums the character- inappropriateness of the lyrics to "I Feel Pretty". ("Here is this illiterate Puerto Rican girl, and you know she would be right at home in Noel Coward's drawing room.") As all will agree, this song is much too good to be removed from West Side Story. I propose therefore the following lyrics, more in tune with Maria's social background.
Maria: I'm illiterate.
I reiterate:
So illiterate, I'm bitter. It's
A shame.
I'm illiterate,
And I can't even read my name.
I'm untutored
And uneducated.
I just vegetated through half of
My youth.
Unemployable,
Unhygenic, and a bit uncouth.
When I was in Noel Coward's drawing room,
Trying to be witty and chic,
Everybody glowered,
Even Noel cowered
When he heard me speak.
Disadvantaged,
Underprivileged,
Always spurned, 'cause I'm
Learning impaired.
I'd be sexier,
But dyslexia has got me scared.
Chorus: Have you met my good friend Maria,
The one with the grandiose plans?
She wants a successful career,
But goes shopping by looking at pictures on cans.
She's blaming her school,
She's such an ingrate.
Why is she a fool?
It's purely innate.
There's a reason Mar-
Ia's plan slipped.
Take a look at her
High-school transcript.
She followed the top
Curriculum path:
Home Ec, Gym, and Shop,
Remedial Math.
Maria: I'm unlearned
And unlettered.
I could better myself,
But my fate
Has been fettered,
And bilingualism came too late.
See the little ad in the paper there.
What does that advertisement say?
"To advance your race,
Aprenda inglés.
Come enroll today."
Hooked on Phonics
Is the tonic
That will nourish my
Hispanic soul.
For I'm loved
By a semiliterate Pole!
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Was it about a whale?
It was not; but it was whale of a tale. . .
(How did everyone like my Jean Harlow pause?)
It was an espionage novel by Daniel Silva, all about the Vatican and its harboring of Nazi criminals during and after the second world war. . .
Now I'm reading a book about Hollywood detective Elvis Cole.
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RE AMERICAN IDOL:
The worst three performances of the night for me:
1. Vonzell without question. Sang sharp or flat on almost everything, got drowned out by the backup singers and eventually just sang accompaniment FOR THEM, and then went into her head voice for the last vocal phrase, and it was so sharp my teeth started cracking. Really, really terrible for her tonight.
2. Carrie. She seemed indifferent to the music and showed a total lack of interest in singing through much of the song, also looked very uncomfortable singing. The low notes were off, and those high notes in the song she had to strain to reach. She got to them, but they weren't pretty. Her worst vocal performance of the competition.
3. Anwar - pitch was all over the map, and I didn't find his showmanship enough to offset the indifferent vocal. A couple of high notes couldn't save a basically sloppy, uninteresting performance.
Best of the night for me was Anthony whose ease with the singing was noticeable. He seemed happy, upbeat, and confident, and his singing was a thousand percent improved.
Scott, sorry to say, had an excellent performance tonight. I'm not sure he got all the words right, but the notes were all there, and his tone was very ingratiating. Nope, his body language and stage presence sucks, but on the basis of just his voice, the second best of the night.
I also liked Bo and COnstantine.
Now, as for busy signals for the two hours I called, Carrie's line was by far the busiest. Scott's was also constantly busy, so I'm afraid to say we're going to see them again next week.
Not busy nearly as much were Anwar's (the least busy), Constantine, and Anthony. Hope that's not a sign of things to come. I don't mind Anwar leaving, but the other two are too talented to go away just yet.
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Well, since Matt H opened the door...
Yes, Vonzell was a bit pitchy, but as Simon pointed out, her personality carried her. But the girl does need to think before she opens her mouth,
I didn't mind Carrie's performance, and she did admit she had no real connection to the song, but who could? ;) At least she took the risk for the high belting.
As for Anwar... He was my YIKES for the evening. For someone who supposedly is a voice teacher, it sure doesn't show. No support, and it seems like he never really learned the song - or any song up to now (at least the ones I've seen.) I do have to wonder if he - or anyone else in the competition - actually learns each song "straight" - no riffing, no melismas. Anwar just seemed to be opening his mouth and that was about it. What came out is what came out. He just seemed to be coasting. And there was even a sort of blankness in his eyes - like he was just trying to connect with the camera and not with the song. It sounds like he's depending on the mic - and the sound board op - to do the work for him. I have a sense that he could be really amazing if he actually applied himself seriously.
Anthony was good tonight too - when did all the makeup start? or is he the new spokesman for ProActiv? ;-)
Constantine was good, not great. And weird makeup on him too.
Scott picked a great song for him tonight. Not a risky song, but a very good performance. And Simon hit it on the head with the "ordinary guy" comment.
Bo did a great job, but his selection of material also showed his self-admitted limited range - the rocker. I just have to wonder how marketable he would be should he win the competition.
...and that's my $0.02..
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DR MS has a new avatar as well. The times they are a changin'!
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DR td - I gave you a Bunny Watson response.
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I just had me a deliciously delicious massage and I be floating on air.
Going to sit on the couch like so much fish and finish my movie.
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Thanks for all the comments and compliments on my new avatar. I may change it since I found a couple of more "candidates" while I was editing that one. We'll see...
But until then...
Goodnight.
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OK...
Page Eight Dance...
Which will be the Last Dance for me tonight.
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td, I like the Elvis Cole detective novels. I know Robert Crais, the author slightly. He and Harlan Ellison are good friends and we have supped together at Harlan's house. At Harlan's 65th b'day, Ellison took Bob,myself, and Stan Lee on an exclusive tour of the house. It was the first time I had seen all of it. Later Bob and I were chatting in Harlan's dining-room and we look over and Spock and Chekov were sitting at the dining-room table, chatting. I just looked back at Crais and said: "surreal." He nodded. Bob's a heck of nice guy and a good mystery writer and deserving of all his success.
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I am heading to bed, but I wanted to share this story. We need more people like her in this world.
Angel of Mercy (http://www.commondreams.org/headlines05/0418-05.htm)
(http://www.commondreams.org/headlines03/images/1230-04.jpg)
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Sad story, DRJOEY.
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DR CP - is this the house that Mr Ellison has dubbed Ellison Wonderland?
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Oh - and in just a few minutes - since NAME'S THE SAME finished it's run, GSN is showing a 5-week wonder called WHAT'S GOING ON that you might want to take a look at. It tried to use television technology to the fullest, with one team in the studio trying to guess what another team outside the studio was doing.
And the Mystery Guest on WML tonight is Miss Betty Hutton.
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Yes, it is Ellison Wonderland and it is a wonder.