Haines His Way
Archives => Archive 1 => Topic started by: bk on March 22, 2004, 12:00:59 AM
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Well, you've read the notes (newbies included), you've had no trouble understanding the notes because they are so straightforward, so now it's time for you to post until the cows come home. To it, I say.
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First post, first post, is it mine??
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Was that the name of a Rodgers & Hart song Ann?
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My Funny Valentine.
To Keep My Love Alive
I Could Write A Book
My Romance
This Can't Be Love
A Ship Without A Sail
Sing For Your Supper
(I could list many others).
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Well, there are the obvious ones:
BLUE MOON
THIS CAN'T BE LOVE
WHERE OR WHEN
SMALL HOTEL
EASY TO REMEMBER (BUT SO HARD TO FORGET)
I'm also find of:
IT NEVER ENTER MY MIND
GLAD TO BE UNHAPPY
YOU TOOK ADVANTAGE OF ME
I'LL TELL THE MAN IN THE STREET
QUIET NIGHT
SOON
I MARRIED AN ANGEL
I'm also fond of a ditty from ON YOUR TOES called TWO A DAY FOR KEITH, as well as the whole score for BOYS FROM SYRACUSE.
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Sorry about wussburgering out early last night. I was tired. I lay down. I conked out. (A Caesar-ish reference, and I don't mean Sid.)
My problem with Rodgers and Hart's work as a team is that I remember Rodgers' contribution, but Hart's just floats on by. Thus, the "Slaughter on Tenth Avenue" ballet sticks with me more than the rest of the On Your Toes score. (Somewhere, I've got a CD including "Slaughter" re-realized for synthesizer, I believe by a one-man band called "Synergy". I don't think we have the track as recorded by Arthur Fiedler and the Boston Pops, with which I grew up.)
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Dear BK, I think it's the Claritin D getting your sentences in order, and I wonder if the school systems shouldn't just start passing it out like candy to their failing students to promote clearer syntax and rational thought.
Last evening's chat was such fun that I cannot wait until next week. There are some really wonderful folk on this site and BK is (in Mrs Malaprop's terminology) the pineapple of perfection as our host.
Rodgers & Hart are possibly my faves, but then along comes a Kern song like "Till the Clouds Roll By" or "Long Ago And Far Away" by another romantic lyricist Mr Ira Gershwin and it's hard to decide. I'm also partial to P.G. Wodehouse whimsical lyrics as well: he strikes me as another Hart-like writer, a little cynical and whimsical, but very romantic when Kern's fantastic tunes send his words afloat.
So, Rodgers & Hart faves:
WHERE THE HUDSON RIVER FLOWS
when the moon is shining down on Wall Street
meet me in the shadow of the wall
then we'll run through every large and small street
half a mile from Broadway you can hear the crickets call
we will find a wagon we can speed in
all the thickest woods we'll journey through
and I'll feel like Adam in his Eden
in the lovely Bronx with you
BYE AND BYE
MY ROMANCE
LITTLE GIRL BLUE
ISN'T IT ROMANTIC?
EVERY SUNDAY AFTERNOON
YOU'RE NEARER
SPRING IS HERE
YOU TOOK ADVANTAGE OF ME
JOHNNY ONE-NOTE
THE HEART IS QUICKER THAN THE EYE
And the list goes and grows . . .
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My guests from out of town went out for dinner and came home and watched last bit of the show and then watched it on tape. At one point I turne to them and asked if they thought she got the questions ahead of time. They thought so. I also thought that she must have work done on her face. too perfect and all you had to do was look at her hands to see they looked a lot older and she was wearing a high necked sweater which is also a give away. At first I thought she was well spoken and meaningful but it was all well rehearsed, As for the lighting I wondered she was sitting so far away from James Lipton. And his running joke about singing at the Bon Soir was funny. We also thought that after awhile that she forgot about this award or that award or that honor was a failed attempted to make her seem more humble. But when they showed her clips of singing in the 1960's and her most recent album it pointed up the difference between her sound then and now. I prefer the 60's streisand sounds more natural.
BUT in the end it really was a PR ploy on her part as the DVD release of her MGM concert is out in two weeks.
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As for Mr. Larry Hart, there are so many out there. Mr. Ben Bagley released several volumes of Rodgers and Hart "rare" songs and of course all the cast albums. So to paraphrase Mr. Jason Graae Rodgers and Hart are good for the soul. Here is my Cole Porter List.
So In Love
True Love
From This Moment on
Come to the Supermarket
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Ah DRCHARLES POGUE has already named my favorite R/H song: "It Nevered Entered My Mind.' :D
I also have to mention "You Mustn't Kick it Around", "Plant You Now", and "A Ship Without a Sail."
Too bad last year's revival of THE BOYS FROM SYRACUSE turned out so badly. :'(
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Oh, and "Mountain Greenery"....damn they all come back to you...and you can't pick just one...LOL.
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Oh, and "Mountain Greenery"....damn they all come back to you...and you can't pick just one...LOL.
It's so true! How could I have forgotten "It Never Entered My Mind" and that great line from the second refrain: "the man who came to dinner lets me eat alone"?
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Just finished catching up after being e&t all weekend. Spent aforementioned weekend putting the computer back into working order. Everything seems to be working well. We were able to get most important stuff off before the final crash and now thanks to zip drives and recordable CDs I can restore fonts and some documents and programs that were lost. Huzzah! More tweaking will be done but at least we're back on line and computer-enabled once more.
Went to a christening party in Brooklyn yesterday and had a nice time seeing Anthony's cousins and aunts and uncles. Then we came home, stuffed from too much Italian food and watched a portion of Pretension personified AKA James Lipton. It was interesting at first but as others have noted, it all seemed to be rehearsed and rather dull after a while. Not that I would expect Mr. Lipton to ask anything even remotely untoward or unseemely but his ass-kissing reached new heights last night. We turned it off after about 45 minutes and had some over-ripe pears (the Bartletts seem to ripen so quickly) and did more work on the computer, loading the photo editing program and the digital camera software.
So many songs have been mentioned already but I'll just say them over again. My Romance is one of my favorites. I Wish I Were in Love Again (when love congeals, it soon reveals, the faint aroma of performing seals, the double crossing of a pair of heels, I wish I were in love again - great lyric!). This Can't Be Love (I always remember the coffee commercial from the 60s or was it the 70s This can't be coffee cause it tastes so good, they took the bitter taste out). And more, and more.
Well, I will now listen to the Donald Feltham show and get to work on this cool March morning. TTFN
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Larry Hart is my favorite lyricist.
As I think of a song, I often remember where and when I first heard it.
Nobody's Heart from "By Jupiter" is probably my favorite. The others include, among others:
Wait Till You See Her
Sing for Your Supper
I'll Tell the Man on the Street
This Funny World
Where or When
Thou Swell
I Didn't Know What Time It Was
This Can't Be Love
My Funny Valentine
Johnny One Note
I Could Write a Book
The Lady Is a Tramp
Little Girl Blue
Manhattan
Zip
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ah yes...DRELMORE.... "...order orange juice for one..."
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My Romance (my current favorite song - by anybody)
I Feel at Home With You (my former favorite song - by anybody)
Quiet Night
Why Can't I
You Are Too Beautiful
Wait Till You See Her
My Friend the Night
Manhattan
Take Him
It Never Entered My Mind
My Funny Valentine
It's Got To Be Love
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My Romance (my current favorite song - by anybody)
Don't you love that turn at the end of the verse:
We don't need that flow'ry fuss
No sir, madame, not for us
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LOL....clever is such a shallow word to use....but it fits....Lorenz Hart was a clever fellow.
And of course, I have related this story before BUT - at one time out of Cincinatti there was a bunch of people doing shows including Bob Braun, an elephant of a man who thought he could sing. People appearing in shows in the Ohio Valley always visited the 50-50 Club to promote their shows.
Kitty Carlisle and Jack Jones were doing Maytime in the neighborhood and stopped by - mid 1960's I would guess as I recall....and Braun introduced them and rattled on and on, eventually marrying Kitty off the Lorenz Hart. She was horrified and graciously said..."no no no....I was married to Moss Hart the director...." Braun never acknowledged his mistake or her correction but plowed on in his own way....
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There are so many Rodgers & Hart songs that I love and many of them have already been listed, but if I think of some more, I'll add them.
Mufti shows are not reviewed since they don't think it's fair to the cast with so little rehearsal. However I want to make a couple of comments on this weekend's BEST FOOT FORWARD. On one hand, it was one of the best Mufti shows I have seen, and of the 43 shows so far, I have seen 34 of them. But on the other hand, they seem to be moving farther and farther away from the original Mufti idea of simplicity and faithfullness to the original. Although once or twice they have done shows that were revised by the original writers, this is the first Mufti show with a concert adaptor credited. What we ended up with was a book and score that was based on the 1941 original but with several new plot twists, a couple of songs from the movie and revival and one brand new song. Since the new song was from 89-year-old Hugh Martin who wrote much of the original score (Martin and Blane worked together but each wrote separate songs), that is okay. But the idea of Mufti has never been to present new versions of old shows... it's to present old shows that never get produced or as the York's artistic director Jim Morgan says "if we don't do them nobody else will". Secondly, the very term Mufti means "in street clothes, without trappings". While prior shows have had a bit of costuming here and there, this is the first fully costumed Mufti show and the first with a costume designer credited. Again, they were very nice, but were not what Mufti is supposed to be. So as much as I enjoyed the show, I hope that it is not a sign that Mufti is going to try and become bigger and flashier, or that its audiences are going to expect more in the future. If so, it will be good... but it won't really be Mufti. Next week's FANNY may tell the tale.
I now have a question for someone who might know: who is it that requires that the cast carries scripts at concert groups like Mufti, Encores, Musicals Tonight, etc.? At various times I have heard it is the rightsholders who claim that this differentiates a concert and a full production and by using scripts it is considered a concert and therefore the royalties are lower; at other times I have heard it is Equity which says that with such a short rehearsal period memorization is not required. Yet rarely are these books referred to, but the cast seems to be required to carry them anyway. So who requires them and if someone in the cast knows his/her lines can he/she do the show without them?
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The smell of citrus blooms is everywhere in the city-- truly my favorite time of year ;D
On the other hand, it's ONLY supposed to get to 94 today.
Be back later with songs.
Need to go get a new battery for my car. I probably need a new one for myself too.
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I could give a long, long list of Rodgers and Hart songs that I love because I think they were a brilliant team, but I'll mention only my absolute favorite of their tunes:
"I Didn't Know What Time It Was"
Frank Sinatra sings a fine version of it in the PAL JOEY film (interpolated into the movie, of course. It's from TOO MANY GIRLS), but my favorite rendition is y Julie Andrews on BROADWAY'S FAIR JULIE and later reissued on A LITTLE BIT OF BROADWAY. Her interpretation is so simple, direct, and filled with longing. Pure heaven.
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And of course, I have related this story before BUT - at one time out of Cincinatti there was a bunch of people doing shows including Bob Braun, an elephant of a man who thought he could sing. People appearing in shows in the Ohio Valley always visited the 50-50 Club to promote their shows.
DR JRand53, when I was around 8 or so, my mother, her four sisters, and all their children went to the 50-50 Club and Ruth Lyons actually talked to me on camera. I was much more talkative than Benjamin Kritzer. My only real memories of Cincinnati television are Willy Thall, Ruth Lyons' constant praising of Hildegarde, and Ruth's annual Christmas drive. My Aunt Dorothy had the Ruth Lyons songbook. Remember "Let's Light the Christmas Tree"?
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I saw the last 45 minutes of the first hour of the Lipton/Streisand love fest, and it nauseated me. She came across to me as totally phony and indeed the entire set-up just too gushy and adoring. And you're right NO PROBING QUESTIONS. Why talk about the film of FUNNY GIRL if you're not going to ask about wonderful songs dropped from the stage version and how she felt about that.
And seeing the footage from her early TV work just reinforces in my mind what a powerful, involving performer she was then and how much I don't like a majority of her current efforts.
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I saw the last 45 minutes of the first hour of the Lipton/Streisand love fest, and it nauseated me. She came across to me as totally phony and indeed the entire set-up just too gushy and adoring. And you're right NO PROBING QUESTIONS. Why talk about the film of FUNNY GIRL if you're not going to ask about wonderful songs dropped from the stage version and how she felt about that.
Well, I would have asked two things:
1. How influential was she in getting Anne Francis' role cut down?
2. How did she feel about Sofia Coppola's Oscar nomination after LENTIL?
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Of course DRElmore I remember Ruth Lyons. It was after she retired that the 50-50 Club went to the dogs! One 90 minute commercial for delicious Tyson Chicken products! I probably saw YOU - my mom always watched Ruth. We had one of her Christmas albums!
DRMATTH you were talking about "No More" yesterday, and I am so in agreement with you. That song gets me everytime....and if you could make it through without crying, well...you are stronger than I am!
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I wasn't knocking Sondheim yesterday, but, rather, saying something about the different eras he, Hart and Rodgers & Hammerstein wrote in.
In the 20's and 30's, cleverness, especially in rhyme, was prized. Hart brilliantly turned out real emotion that was simultaneously clever "Only my book in bed knows how I look in bed." In those days, writing songs that could only come from the particular character singing them wasn't relatively important (although, as was pointed out, Hart did that, too).
In the 40's and 50's, starting with the revolution of Oklahoma!, audience expected love stories with songs unique to their characters, and ones that moved the plot along. While I like Rodgers & Hart songs better than Rodgers & Hammerstein songs, as SHOW-writers, no one tops Rodgers & Hammerstein.
Sondheim's Company was fairly revolutionary in 1970. As I said, he's got cleverness in spades (playing card analogy alert) but the era he wrote in didn't particularly prize cleverness as much as other virtues. I love "She sits at the Ritz with her splits of Mumm's and starts to pine for a stein with her village chums but with her mitts 'round a Schlitz down in Fitzroy's bar, she thinks of the Ritz - Oh, it's so schizo!" ... but that song's not as well-known as it would have been if it had been part of a hit like Babes In Arms.
In working on the Bock & Harnick revue last year, I put together something I called the "Elation of Love" medley: songs that express how wonderful it feels to be in love. Oscar Hammerstein's I'm In Love with a Wonderful Guy is the type of song his protege Sondheim would never consider writing. For Sondheim, illuminating the euphoria of romance isn't a strong suit (in this sense, he's weak in hearts). But, as someone writing in a post-Oklahoma era, he of course digs into the psychologies of his characters, and he does this extremely well (like diamonds).
There's an obvious difference between the revolutions of Oklahoma and, say, Follies, which is that the earlier audience immediately embraced the change. Oklahoma was a hit of unprecedented proportions; the public loved this new more-serious story where the songs fit the time, place and character. Around the time of Follies, a younger composer (with the same birthday), Andrew Lloyd Webber, burst on to the scene. Now, if you know me at all, you know I think Sondheim is ten times the songwriter Lloyd Webber is, but the audience doesn't agree. ALW wrote hit after hit. This leads me to wonder if the public was/is ready for musicals that don't contain traditional love songs. Is it really so surprising that a protagonist-less musical about the westernization of Japan didn't have a long run? Theatre-goers crave romance, which is why The Phantom of the Opera continues to run.
Finally, I'll repeat something that I don't think was understood. Yes, Sondheim often writes very emotional songs, and these move me greatly. Joy's rendition of So Many People in her cabaret act; Guy's What Can You Lose on the Sondheim movie song album; Losing My Mind in countless settings. It's the whole shows, in the theatre (where they were meant to be heard) that often pull me up short. It's why I see him as the opposite of his mentor: a great SONGwriter, a less good SHOWwriter. (He hasn't got a lot of clubs.)
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The smell of citrus blooms is everywhere in the city-- truly my favorite time of year ...
Here too is the smell of citrus, but we're talking orange and grapefruit peels. Minus 18 (Celsius) today.
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My first real exposure to the works of Rodgers and Hart was through a reel-to-reel tape of Ella Fitzgerald's Rodgers and Hart Songbook (vols 1 & 2 on one tape.) It was love at first hearing. Initially, it was Ella's divine voice and phrasing and the lush orchestrations that grabbed me. But I eventually came to realize that it was also the particular wit, romance and sophistication of the words and music that won me over.
I think my favorite song, lyric-wise, would be "It Never Entered My Mind". DRs elmore and JRand already quoted some of the great lines in that song. I'll add another phrase: "Uneasy in my easy chair". Sigh... That's exquisiteness defined.
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Good morning. Sorry, I can't just pick one Rodgers & Hart song...
*MY FUNNY VALENTINE
*BEWITCHED, BOTHERED AND BEWILDERED (Now where can you find a lyric like...
I'll sing to him
Each spring to him
And worship the trousers that cling to him)
*I DIDN'T KNOW WHAT TIME IT WAS
*FALLING IN LOVE WITH LOVE
*I COULD WRITE A BOOK
*THIS CAN'T BE LOVE
And those are just the ones which occur to me right now. In half an hour I'll have a different list.
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Oh Dan the Man - yup....uneasy in my easy chair...whew!
With Rodgers beautiful music....whew.
Dynamite collaboration!
I was in a revue Rodgers & Hart: A Celebration as a dancer and it was such a delight!
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I could give a long, long list of Rodgers and Hart songs that I love because I think they were a brilliant team, but I'll mention only my absolute favorite of their tunes:
"I Didn't Know What Time It Was"
Frank Sinatra sings a fine version of it in the PAL JOEY film (interpolated into the movie, of course. It's from TOO MANY GIRLS), but my favorite rendition is by Julie Andrews on BROADWAY'S FAIR JULIE and later reissued on A LITTLE BIT OF BROADWAY. Her interpretation is so simple, direct, and filled with longing. Pure heaven.
DR Matt H,
I couldn't agree more. Julie Andrews' album introduced me to that song and others. Every cut on "Broadway's Fair Julie" - A Little Bit in Love, This Is New - If Love Were All - is a treasure.
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Speaking of "A Little Bit in Love," that certainly is a pallid singer/actress playing Eileen on the new WONDERFUL TOWN cast album.
Those of you who have seen the show in NYC, is she as nondescript on stage as she is on that recording?
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BEWITCHED, BOTHERED AND BEWILDERED (Now where can you find a lyric like...
I'll sing to him
Each spring to him
And worship the trousers that cling to him)
... but in the Doris Day version: "And long for the day when I cling to him."
(and forget about, "Vexed again ... ")
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Good morning. Sorry, I can't just pick one Rodgers & Hart song...
*BEWITCHED, BOTHERED AND BEWILDERED (Now where can you find a lyric like...
I'll sing to him
Each spring to him
And worship the trousers that cling to him)
DR Panni, I love the frank humor of these lines from the same:
Vexed again, perplexed again
Thank God I can be oversexed again
Seen a lot, I mean a lot
And now I'm like sweet seventeen a lot
I suspect Hart identified with Vera Simpson and her young men and knew both the homor and hurt of it
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Thanks, Kerry!
Favorite Rodgers & Hart songs:
Blue Moon (I always forget that this is a Rodgers & Hart song)
It Never Entered My Mind
Johnny One-Note (and Klea Blackhurst's "Ethel One-Note")
Little Girl Blue (especially the Nina Simone version)
My Funny Valentine (I LOVE Cleo Laine's version)
Sing For Your Supper
To Keep My Love Alive (Elaine Stritch's version on PBS!)
Zip
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I am all for "It Never Entered My Mind," "Where or When," "To Keep My Love Alive," "Johnny One Note," and let's not forget "Manhattan."
As for emotional high points written by today's birthday boy, "No More," turns on the waterworks here too. And I concur on "With So Little to Be Sure Of. But don't forget the heart-rending pathos of "Losing My Mind." Those are emotions that are worn on the sleeve like no other.
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Well, as per usual, AOL is not working this morning. Can't even launch it - I've sent the nice lady an e-mail and we'll see how it goes. Otherwise, as soon as I figure out how to transfer over all the names in my address book and as soon as I figure out how to get my other e-mail addresses set up, I'll be cancelling if they don't fix this today.
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Wise choice!
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Not really C i n e m a S c o p e more like N a t u r a m a
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I love that I'm not the only one here who loathes James Lipton and all he stands for.
I'll admit when I first saw Actor's Studio several years ago I found it somewhat interesting, though even then I remember thinking that this guy was just WAY too obsequious. But hey, back in those days he was interviewing the likes of Robert DeNiro (pre-Analyze This and Meet the Parents, back when he still had some cache) and I thought "heck, if it were me opposite DeNiro, I'd probably come across as obsequious, too."
Now he's interviewing Melanie Griffith and (for all I know) Carrot Top about their legendary careers and the cognitive dissonance is VERY apparent. WHO DOES HE THINK HE'S KIDDING???? winds up being the comment du jour whenever he trots out the likes of Lara Flynn Boyle and begins pledging his undying obesiance.
As for Babs...the woman was gifted with an amazing voice, and a deft comic flair that's apparent in Funny Girl, What's Up, Doc, For Pete's Sake, etc. But at some point (probably around the thousandth time someone told her how absolutely completely astoudingly FABULOUS she was), her ego attained the girth of a medium-sized independent republic (possibly Lichtenstein...? I'm not a geography whiz, help me out here, folks). The woman is Royalty at this point, and like all royalty, she has a completely skewed sense of herself, the world, and her place within said world.
As for the way she currently styles herself (ie: lighting, face-tightening, et. al.), I think Michael J. Nelson perhaps said it best in his review of The Mirror Has Two Faces when he wrote "She was a fine-looking woman, 55-years-old, when the film was made. She should act her age -- start getting used to the taste of Ensure and Feenamint; get a start at buying the first of many crisp blazers and neat slacks; begin asking for discounts on bruised produce. This tarting about, playing roles that should go to Ally Sheedy, has got to stop." (Mr. Nelson also noted the inherent absurdity of Mimi Rogers portraying Barbra's OLDER sister in this film.)
Now for 'fessing up time: did I actually watch last nights Very Special episode of Inside the Actor's Studio? No, I did not. And I wouldn't have if I'd known about it. We were otherwise occupied - namely, with Baby Face (Barbara Stanwyck) and an episode of the live-action Sailor Moon that is currently airing in Japan. I was also busy joining (finally) NetFlix, more on which later.
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I, too, avoided the Babs-fest last night.
As a singer, myself, I loved her astounding virtuosity, the unmistakable artistry, the unique sound (yes, even the homage to Barbara Cook in her phrasing) - loved her film comedies. But as Onassis once cruelly said to Callas: "Yeah? Who are you? You got a whistle in yer throat, an' it's broken."
BS currently is short for BS. The mindless, self-absorbed drivel that spews from that former faucet of sublime sound is just revolting. Sorry to offend any BS fans. Gimme Barbara Cook, any day.
And, by the way:
Wait 'Til You See Her is my favorite (having heard same B. Cook sing it as Wait 'Til You See Him).
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I just finished Friday's notes and will be working my way through the weekend, having been E&T and a Wussburger for lo these many days, for reasons you can well guess.
I drove out to the end of the Island of Long in a snow storm on Friday morning and managed to get Joe home by 10:00. Amusing it was that another inmate who was being released shook my hand and said, "Your son [sic] is a great guy. He helped a lot of people in there." I smiled and took the compliment in the spirit in which it was meant.
Joe has been up and down, physically, all weekend. He slept 4 hours Friday night, 16 hours Saturday night. I'm getting him to the doctor this afternoon. The weekend was mostly hugs, hugs, some hugs, a few more hugs, eggs and hugs, ham and hugs, eggs and ham and spam and hugs and hugs and hugs.
Thank you all for your splendid wishes and support.
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WFO:
HUG your Joe back to health and happiness.
It works!!
:)
*hugs to both of you*
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bk - I'm Internet-challenged, so this may be a ridiculous question - but can your AOL woes have something to do with your recent switch to a high speed cable modem?
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My guests from out of town went out for dinner and came home and watched last bit of the show and then watched it on tape. At one point I turne to them and asked if they thought she got the questions ahead of time. They thought so. I also thought that she must have work done on her face. too perfect and all you had to do was look at her hands to see they looked a lot older and she was wearing a high necked sweater which is also a give away. At first I thought she was well spoken and meaningful but it was all well rehearsed, As for the lighting I wondered she was sitting so far away from James Lipton. And his running joke about singing at the Bon Soir was funny. We also thought that after awhile that she forgot about this award or that award or that honor was a failed attempted to make her seem more humble. But when they showed her clips of singing in the 1960's and her most recent album it pointed up the difference between her sound then and now. I prefer the 60's streisand sounds more natural.
BUT in the end it really was a PR ploy on her part as the DVD release of her MGM concert is out in two weeks.
There was a telling comment by James Lipton that "dated" that session as having been done sometime last year. He was at 1966, and then he said, "Here we are 37 years later and...." Lipton is pretty well-prepared most all the time, and he would not have made that mistake had it been 2004.
I really enjoyed it. I can't imagine The Actor's Studio having any sort of agenda regarding any video releases of Streisand's concerts.
It could have been a marketing thing between Bravo and Barwood...re-showing the episode with the concerts being advertisers...but that's done all the time.
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WFO - Good to hear you have Joe safe at home!
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Too bad Robert Sterling who played Mike in RETURN TO PEYTON PLACE didn't play the role in PEYTON PLACE, too!
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Lulu posted:
As for the way she currently styles herself (ie: lighting, face-tightening, et. al.), I think Michael J. Nelson perhaps said it best in his review of The Mirror Has Two Faces when he wrote "She was a fine-looking woman, 55-years-old, when the film was made. She should act her age -- start getting used to the taste of Ensure and Feenamint; get a start at buying the first of many crisp blazers and neat slacks; begin asking for discounts on bruised produce. This tarting about, playing roles that should go to Ally Sheedy, has got to stop." (Mr. Nelson also noted the inherent absurdity of Mimi Rogers portraying Barbra's OLDER sister in this film.)
Speaking as a 55-year-old male who has no need of Ensure, Feenamint or bruised produce, I'm totally offended by this review...and shocked that anyone would propose it as an appropriate idea to be applied, in its entirety, to anyone who is 55 years old.
For cryin' out loud! :(
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But I KNOW you have a closet full of crisp blazers and neat slacks, DRRLP....don't we all?
Welcome home JOE!!!!!!!!
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For work clothes, yeah....but I still have jeans and chinos and T-shirts and NB sneakers/walking shoes for kicking around in.
Guess I'm too old for that now, huh! :P
And since there's no point in getting "all tarted up", that only leaves leisure suits to wear in the assisted living home.
Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr!
It's bad enough that there are ageists out there trying to put older citizens into tight little categories that they can feel comfortable with, but Streisand has been putting up with it all her life because she's a Jewish woman.
I fully understand her anger and her passion. I'm just surprised that others who have faced other sorts of discrimination in their lifetimes find it so easy and convenient to put Streisand down for one reason or another.
Like life isn't/hasn't been hard enough???
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I have to put in my two cents worth on the Streisand bashing today. Let me say off the top that I've never been a huge fan - but I respect her enormous talent. I also respect the fact that she made it on her own terms.
What I don't understand is the animosity - verging on contempt - towards this woman. So she has an oversized ego. She's certainly not alone in our business in that. So she wants to look young. So do 9 out of 10 other stars -- men included. So she orchestrates her interview. The woman is a control freak -- we know many fantastic talents who share that trait.
I just get very uncomfortable with words like "revolting" when it comes to describing any aspect of a supremely talented woman who has done iconic work.
Many huge talents leave a great deal to be desired in the personality department. And most huge talents at 60 are not what they were at 23. Can we not cut them - her - some slack?
And let me add that I'm not criticizing any particular DRs here. It's just something I want to express.
We do have a tendency in this country to forget what people have done. You're as good as your last picture/album/book. Think of Billy Wilder, David Lean, Buster Keaton,... oh the list could go on for pages. Great artists who couldn't get a picture made or a good role or a writing gig because time moves on. Streisand doesn't exactly fit in here - but in a way she does. We can't dismiss what she did at the height of her talent because of who she is today. End of rant.
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Well, sure, I'd have liked it better if Lipton delved more, and we got more revealed of the true Babs. (And no mention of What's Up Doc seems a shocking omission.) But I think we're avoiding giving some credit where it's due. Barbra Streisand doesn't do interviews very often. It's extraordinary for her to sit down and answer questions for more than five hours. And this she did for James Lipton.
Now maybe she did it because she KNEW he wouldn't probe too hard, and knew he'd be obsequious. There are a lot of interviewers out there, and we might like them all better than Lipton. But they ain't got Streisand in their chairs. Good for him for getting her.
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What I don't understand is the animosity - verging on contempt - towards this woman. So she has an oversized ego. She's certainly not alone in our business in that. So she wants to look young. So do 9 out of 10 other stars -- men included.
I consider myself a feminist; but I still find it ridiculous when stars in their 50's and 60's insist on playing roles that are at least two or three decades too young for them. That goes for men (Jack Nicholson, Michael Douglas, et. al.) as well as women (Joan Crawford was also justly infamous for this late in her career). And frankly, when the star in question makes a film (like The Mirror Has Two Faces) that insists the audience believe her character is the gorgeous (without realizing it, of course) younger sister of an actress who is in fact 15 years younger than she, that star opens him or herself to criticism that emphasizes his or her age.
And the enormous ego thing...again, I find this an extraordinarily unattractive trait in both men and women.
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Well, I'm now an official AOL Beta tester - have the absolute latest version of 9.0 because we're hoping that will circumvent the problems we've been having.
The latest: What's happening is that the "aol adaptor" is causing problems. We uninstall, that's easy. Then everything works fine. When I log off at the end of the evening, the new AOL 9.0 that we installed on Friday is doing an automatic update - this has happened every night. In so doing it reinstalls the AOL adaptor. I then have to uninstall it, everything is fine, until I log off at the end of the evening. In other words, I'm in an endless loop. The tech thought that by downloading the beta test version of the latest latest 9.0 that might circumvent the problem. We shall see. If it doesn't, I have two more options other than just cancelling: I can revert to 8.0 or I can just stay logged on to AOL all the time. The computer goes to screensave mode anyway after twenty minutes of inactivity, so that should work fine, won't overload anything at all.
I'll know which route I'll take soon.
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Speaking as a 55-year-old male who has no need of Ensure, Feenamint or bruised produce, I'm totally offended by this review...and shocked that anyone would propose it as an appropriate idea to be applied, in its entirety, to anyone who is 55 years old.
For cryin' out loud! :(
Surely I'm correct in reading the Ensure, Feenamint, etc. remarks as hyperbole? You know, exaggeration for comedic effect.
Anyway, I think the writer's point is clear. You may or may not agree that it taxes the audience's willing suspension of disbelief when stars insist upon playing roles that are meant for someone two or three decades younger - even resorting to having an actress 15 years their junior portraying a "younger" sibling. But I hardly think it can be argued that those of us who do think such posturing is ridiculous are guilty of ageism.
I love it when films portray believable romantic relationships between characters who aren't the requisite 20 1/2 years of age (was anyone here NOT swept off their feet by the romance of Edgar Halcyon and Anna Madrigal in Tales of the City)? But that's a totally different thing from people who are 50+ trying to shoehorn themselves into roles MEANT for 20-year-olds (as if 20-years-old is the only thing to be; the gold standard, if you will, of humanity). When that happens, imo, the only suitable response is derisive laughter.
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Speaking of "A Little Bit in Love," that certainly is a pallid singer/actress playing Eileen on the new WONDERFUL TOWN cast album.
Those of you who have seen the show in NYC, is she as nondescript on stage as she is on that recording?
I saw WT back in November and I unabashedly fell in love with Jennifer Westfeldt as Eileen (but then, I fell in love with everyone in the cast. But then, I'm easy.) Yes, she doesn't do that singing thing that everyone says she doesn't do during "Conversation Piece", but I found her vocals to be otherwise very satisfying. In fact, I found everything she did on stage very satisfying, indeed.
I've been listening to the cast recording this morning for the first time, and I'm having a few problems with it. There were a couple of places where the CD seemed to distinctly "skip", which sounded more like a bad edit job than a defect on the CD itself. Also, during "One Hundred Easy Way", Donna Murphy sounds rather statically, as if she had an upper septum full of phlegm. Anyone else having troubles with this recording?
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My comments were directed at the "review" being held up as an accurate reflection of what a 55-year-old should be doing in life.
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The natives are restless.
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I was underwhelmed with WONDERFUL TOWN's new recording - period. Don't understand what all the shouting's about with Donna Murphy (but I have only the CD to go by; I say up front I haven't seen the show), and I found Jennifer Westfeldt at best innocuous but clearly unmemorable. I did like Gregg Edelmann a lot, the best thing about the recording, I think.
The quality of the recording itself seemed fine to me.
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Good afternoon one and all!
I am at school and I am sick. I blame Jed for spreading his cold via my internet connection.
Dang him... dang him to heck!
My lips and my nosal (yes that is a word) area are chapped
My head feels like it's filled with pudding
Colds suck. Colds suck especially when it's cold outside (-11 today... I have orange blossom envy DR Kerry!!!)
Anywho... I am supposed to meet up with DR Andrea for sushi tonight but I think I may have to change our sushi date to a soup-i date because soup is what you eat when you have a cold and not raw fish.
I am going to have to think about my favourite R&H songs, although most of the ones you all have mentioned so far are delightful.
Ta for now!
(oooh... get well vibes to WFO's Joe who definitely deserves them ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~)
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I just ordered PEYTON PLACE, MYRA BRECKINRIDGE, and THE SADIST (on recommendation of DR MBARNUM), although since it stars Arch Hall Jr, I would think we viewers would be more in the category of masochists.
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My comments were directed at the "review" being held up as an accurate reflection of what a 55-year-old should be doing in life.
RLP: Yes, I understood that, and (I think) worded my reply accordingly. I noted that the writer appeared to be employing hyperbole for comedic effect, not seriously voicing the conviction that all 55-year-olds should drink Ensure.
Ron, I find it really interesting that you have in the past so vocally decried the so-called "PC Police," yet when it comes to the subject of age, it would seem that certain "un-PC" comments are considered verboten. I particularly remember your spirited defense of the well-worn phrase "when rape is inevitable, lie back and enjoy it" as being merely well-meant ribbing that could only be seen as repulsive and distasteful to the oversensitive and easily offended.
Surely the passage I quoted is not, subjectively speaking, nearly as inflammatory as the "rape" bromide? Yet you found it offensive and hurtful. Perhaps, upon reflection, you'll be moved to re-evaluate your position on other un-PC rhetoric, on the understanding that what may not strike you as offensive can nonetheless aggrieve others.
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I just ordered [...] THE SADIST (on recommendation of DR MBARNUM), although since it stars Arch Hall Jr...
Arch Hall, Jr.
Speaking of inflammatory and offensive...
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3rd page dance
http://burningpixel.com/Baby/Babygif.htm (http://burningpixel.com/Baby/Babygif.htm)
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I don't remember who asked, but Jennifer Westerfield or whatever her name is comes off better on stage than on the CD because she is more of an actress than a singer. When this production originated at Encores, Laura Benatti was a great Eileen, but she was unavailable at the time for this production and when asked in some column if she was sorry she missed it she replied that she had outgrown parts like that... whatever she meant by that. Donna is quite good as Ruth, although it is not quite one of the all time great performance that critics have made it out to be. In fact, her voice is too good for a role that was written for a non-singer.
***
Liza saw WICKED Saturday night and then sang "Cabaret" with Joel Grey as part of the BC/EFA fund raising pitch afterwards.
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A very happy birthday to Mr. Stephen Sondheim!
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I would much rather discuss Mr Sondheim than Ms Streisand. His name never causes controversy.
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RLP: Yes, I understood that, and (I think) worded my reply accordingly. I noted that the writer appeared to be employing hyperbole for comedic effect, not seriously voicing the conviction that all 55-year-olds should drink Ensure.
Ron, I find it really interesting that you have in the past so vocally decried the so-called "PC Police," yet when it comes to the subject of age, it would seem that certain "un-PC" comments are considered verboten. I particularly remember your spirited defense of the well-worn phrase "when rape is inevitable, lie back and enjoy it" as being merely well-meant ribbing that could only be seen as repulsive and distasteful to the oversensitive and easily offended.
Surely the passage I quoted is not, subjectively speaking, nearly as inflammatory as the "rape" bromide? Yet you found it offensive and hurtful. Perhaps, upon reflection, you'll be moved to re-evaluate your position on other un-PC rhetoric, on the understanding that what may not strike you as offensive can nonetheless aggrieve others.
Please refer me to a specific quotation where I said any such thing about the "rape" bromide being what you say I said.
I can recall using it as an example of things that were said to a Navy audience, of which I was a member, at a time when the audience laughed and was not offended BECAUSE AT THAT TIME we were not sensitized to it.
I have never taken the position that the bromide itself was inoffensive...only that in another time and another place, I heard it in a context that was unaware of its insensitivity. If you took it any other way, I am sorry.
As for PC remarks, I am averse to overly PC everything. That does not mean I'm against sensitivity, good taste or manners.
I don't think the bitchiness of that review has anything to do with being PC or anti-PC...it's just bad taste, bad manners and cheapjack journalism.
Of course, it's open to interpretation.
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...now about that Sondheim....
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Who?
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I'm very excited - my new super-duper handy-dandy Jerry Goldsmith limited edition six CD set will be here this afternoon.
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BK did you get my email?
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I apologize to one and all for being argumentative.
I certainly don't want anyone to be upset. Lulu and I were having a spirited discussion, but it was seeming like a bit more to some readers, and I want everyon to understand that I hold no hard feelings for LuLu or anyone else who has stated their opinions on the subject of Ms. Streisand.
Some of us are a bit more aggressive in our discussions and we sometimes forget that others perceive "tones" that are not necessarily there.
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If you really want controversy...
...It's Andrew Lloyd Webber's birthday too! ;)
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Thank you, Panni, for your earlier comments. It used to be, that if someone disliked an actress or an entertainer, they simply avoided their work. They didn’t go see their films, they didn’t listen to their music, and they certainly didn’t turn on the television to watch an interview with someone that they didn’t enjoy. However, Barbra Streisand seems to evoke a whole different set of rules. A great many people I know (and I don’t mean only people at this site), seem to go out of their way to see her films and hear her music and to watch her interviews, for no other reason than to turn around and bash her.
As Panni pointed out, if big egos were banned from the entertainment industry, we would see a lot fewer stars in that firmament. Miss Streisand is certainly not alone in scheduling interviews and public appearances to coincide with the release of a new film or CD. You can look at which stars are appearing on Leno or Letterman in any particular week, and you can pretty well figure out who has a new project coming out in the very near future. Someone yesterday commented on the fact that Streisand even reads her ad-libs off of cue cards. A lot of entertainers script everything in their performances right down to the smallest throw-away line. I can think of Bette Midler, Wayne Newton, Steve and Eydie, and Bob Hope; all of whom are famous for scripted ad-libs.
I don’t want, or expect anyone to like all of the films that I like, or to listen and enjoy all of the singers and musicians that I like; but if you don’t care for someone, then fine, just let it go. I promise that I won't go see Patti LuPone's next Broadway show or buy her next CD, if people would just lighten up a little on Barbra.
As for the casting of people who are not age appropriate, it does make one wonder what Laurence Harvey was trying to do by having Angela Lansbury, who is only three years older than him, play his mother in Manchurian Candiadate.
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RLP - how did you get your hair to do that?
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That casting decision wasn't made by Mr Harvey, DRTCB - and I still think the original choice of Frankenheimer & Sinatra for the role of Mrs Iselin would have been a stunner: Lucille Ball!
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Well, it seems obvious from yesterday’s posts, that Mel Gibson truly missed his mark. If he had really wanted to make a divisive movie, he should have made a film called “The Passion of Stephen Sondheim.” BK’s close and personal friend seems to evoke strong sentiments on both sides of the issue.
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If you really want controversy...
...It's Andrew Lloyd Webber's birthday too! ;)
I like most of his shows and even quite a few of the scores to the shows, but I think I only love Evita. I saw the national tour in Seattle in 1986 with Florence Lacey and I thought that it was spectacular, as was Florence. I love the original Broadway cast recording of Joseph... but don't really like any of the others, especially the later ones. Laurie Beechman was the best narrator and the show itself (based on the recording) was just absolute delightful. It didn't try to be anything other than what it was. The later recordings (and DVD) make it seem like every song is supposed to be a freakin' show-stopper. It's worse than a Jerry Herman musical. I mean, how many orgasms can you have in one night? ;)
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RLP - how did you get your hair to do that?
Do you mean the hair in my picture...or the hair that grew up my....(never mind).
I was young, my hair was fine and very manageable...it was the cut...it wasn't anything out of the ordinary special to me at the time. It was also a photo taken in September...after a full summer of having worked outside.
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I don't know, how many?
It's just that I remember having hair and that's what I wanted mine to look like....but it never did. :P
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Yes, tone is difficult on these boards sometimes. I think we've all misunderstood at one point or another. I always think spirited discussion is great and I encourage it - just respectfully, as happens here most of the time. I've posted things that were meant humorously and didn't read that way -so it made me aware of it and I at least look to make sure that I'm getting across what I want to in the WAY that I want to.
Got your e, Jrand, much thanks.
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Speaking as a 55-year-old male who has no need of Ensure, Feenamint or bruised produce, I'm totally offended by this review...and shocked that anyone would propose it as an appropriate idea to be applied, in its entirety, to anyone who is 55 years old.
For cryin' out loud! :(
LOL-At 55 I made need insure soon, but since I was thirty I have often been told I’m too old to wear the clothes I wear and my long hair should be cut.
When my younger son was ten he asked me if I’m going to wear long hair even when I’m old. To my probably, he thought about it for a moment then decided it was okay, even a good thing, like Jessica Tandy. You can’t beat that for a compliment.
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DR JANE I think you left a out of that sentence.
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Andrew who?
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My "revolting" referred to certain political BS, not the considerable remains of a phenomenal instrument
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DR JANE I think you left a out of that sentence.
I modified & added an and. Where did I need an out? ;D
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WELCOME HOME JOE
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I think I love a lot of Rodgers and Hart songs, but honestly don't know which ones they wrote...and those titles listed (most of them) don't ring a bell with me. If I heard them then I am sure I would recongnize almost all of them....so I will say that some of my favorites have already been listed! LOL!
I have no opinion of Babs S. I loved WHAT'S UP DOC but have not really seen any of her other films, and as for her singing, I am not that familiar with a lot of her work and what I have heard didn't do much for me. But I love Bollywood music and Roger Corman films so what do I know! LOL!
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Welcome home Joe and now get some rest!!
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I think I love a lot of Rodgers and Hart songs, but honestly don't know which ones they wrote...and those titles listed (most of them) don't ring a bell with me. If I heard them then I am sure I would recongnize almost all of them....so I will say that some of my favorites have already been listed! LOL!
I have no opinion of Babs S. I loved WHAT'S UP DOC but have not really seen any of her other films, and as for her singing, I am not that familiar with a lot of her work and what I have heard didn't do much for me. But I love Bollywood music and Roger Corman films so what do I know! LOL!
There's an MGM musical called "Words and Music" that purports to be the story of Rodgers and Hart and is chockful of their tunes.
Never mind that they make Larry Hart (Mickey Rooney) into a pathetic heterosexual spurned by the only woman he could possibly love (Betty Garrett) but who constantly spurned him as something untouchable.
Mickey was short enough to play the part, but in typical Hollywood fashion, Hart was relegated to having a one-true-love-obsession that led him to suicide.
The score is glorious, though!
(Hey! We made it to page 4 and it's not even 1 p.m. PST yet).
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Has anyone picked up the HOWDY DOODY DVDs? I see them at the store and keep thinking that they would be interesting to watch (as Howdy Doody ended a few years before I was born). Does anyone recommend them??
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Here is something new and a little different to get the conversation rolling again. I noticed that Entertainment Weekly and one of their columnists have been receiving some flak in the last two weeks, based on the statement in a recent issue that called Marlon Brando the greatest actor of all time. They did not say the greatest actor of his generation, or even, arguably the best actor of all time; but instead they simply called him, “the greatest actor of all time.” Now, presumably, the writer and / or the magazine truly believe this statement to be true. But I would have to question what criteria they used to reach this decision. Was this choice based on his body of work, or was it based on one particular performance? Was it the stage or the screen? Or both? And if Brando is the greatest, then where do you rank Olivier? Or John Gielgud? Or Richard Burton? Or Henry Fonda? And who has been around long enough to judge some of history’s legendary actors, such as Edwin Booth or James O’Neil or even John Wilkes Booth?
At the same time, should we limit the definition of actor, to only men? Or could the greatest actor of all time be a woman? What of Helen Hayes, Bette Davis, Meryl Streep, Sarah Bernhardt, or Katharine Hepburn?
How would you ever compare all these different styles of acting to determine who is or was the best of all time?
The whole thing kind of boggles my mind. Did some organization or another award Brando this title? Anyone have an opinion on the subject?
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WFO I’m not surprised Joe has been sleeping so much since his return. Hugs & sleeping, all part of the healing process. Hope it went well at the doctor’s today.
Emily feel better soon.
Okay, as difficult as it is I will have to say my favorite song is BEWITCHED, BOTHERED & BEWILDERED. I may change my mind in an hour.
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I [ Laurie Beechman was the best narrator and the show itself (based on the recording) was just absolute delightful.
DR George, I saw that production; a friend from college was the wardrobe mistress and I knew an actor in the show. Your guess is correct: it was an absolute delight and Laurie, God bless her, was quite wonderful!
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LOL DRJANE....I was trying to be funny by leaving the word "word" out of my post.....wasn't funny, was it?
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Wow, for some reason it has taken me FOREVER to catch up on all the posts today and yesterday.
Let me join in and say to DR WFO: I'm so happy Joe is home!
DR Emily: when you said it was -11C, you forgot to mention that with windchill this morning it was -25C.
This makes no sense. On Wed it is supposed to be +6C (43F). And by Friday it is supposed to be in the 50sF.
I just hope this cold front leaves. I want Spring!
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A little while ago, Nancy the postwoman buzzed me. I met her in the lobby, and she handed me a large envelope. Seeing my reaction she said, "that must be something really special." I told her that it certainly was. Sent by airmail, it cost a fortune in postage and took ten days to arrive. But Kritzer Time has finally come to Canada.
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To each his own, but I'd NEVER consider Brando as the greatest actor. He has certainly given devastating performances (my mother and father saw Tandy and Brando in STREETCAR on their honeymoon), but I don't find him especially compelling in the last three or four decades, certainly not since the 1950s. Never understood the hosannahs he got for LAST TANGO IN PARIS, and he and Al Pacino should have been in the opposite Oscar categories for THE GODFATHER. Brando was the supporting actor to me; it was Pacino's picture. For me, that was one of the least worthy Oscars ever given (much less refused).
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It's all value judgments but Mr Brando would not make my top 50. I have seens his roles since the late 60's as being parodies of himself. What do I know? Even the wonderful Sir John G ended up playing much the same role - himself (but was very aware of it and liked the money!).
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Please refer me to a specific quotation where I said any such thing about the "rape" bromide being what you say I said.
I can recall using it as an example of things that were said to a Navy audience, of which I was a member, at a time when the audience laughed and was not offended BECAUSE AT THAT TIME we were not sensitized to it.
I have never taken the position that the bromide itself was inoffensive...only that in another time and another place, I heard it in a context that was unaware of its insensitivity. If you took it any other way, I am sorry.
And I apologize if I misinterpreted your original remarks; I also agree that sensitivity and manners can only make the world a better place.
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... another inmate who was being released shook my hand and said, "[Joe] is a great guy. He helped a lot of people in there."
WFO,
Even in the most trying environment, Joe showed kindness. That's a wonderful testament to his character.
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I don't have anything against Brando, but I've also never understood all the "brilliant/genius/best actor EVER" hoo-ha that's always surrounded him, either.
I suspect (just because I'm cynical) that there's a DVD box set of the Compleat Works of Marlon Brando due out soon; that would nicely explain EW's declaration. ;)
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Could one of the many expert chefs on this here, the happiest site on the Internet, tell me and other inquiring minds what the difference is between steaming and cooking a vegetable. ??? Flavorwise, health benefits-wise. Any wise you choose to discuss. Thank you.
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Could one of the many expert chefs on this here, the happiest site on the Internet, tell me and other inquiring minds what the difference is between steaming and cooking a vegetable. ??? Flavorwise, health benefits-wise. Any wise you choose to discuss. Thank you.
I think that steaming a vegetable is when you make unflattering remarks about its parentage.
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Lulu, I think you may be right about the Brando boxed set, but I hope they don't bring it out on my account!
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I think that steaming a vegetable is when you make unflattering remarks about its parentage.
Thanks TCB. LOL
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By all means get one Howdy Doody DVD to see what you missed. More than one might be overkill.
See today's Peter Filichia column at Theatremania.com for an interesting take on today's birthday boys.
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Panni: I think steamed veggies are vastly preferable to cooked veggies because:
*They retain their vitamins and minerals (when vegetables are cooked in water, a lot of the nutrients "escape" into the water)
*They retain their vivid colors and crisp texture (provided they're not oversteamed).
We use a bamboo steamer, which has the added benefit of three levels (so you can steam three different vegetables separately but simultaneously, or, say, steam two veggies and some potstickers, etc.). Steaming works quite quickly, as well.
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DRLULU did you watch The Midwestern Hayride?
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An unpopular observation about a Brando performance:
I thought him brilliant in "Mutiny on the Bounty." I thought his Fletcher Christian very complex, multi-layered and fascinating. It's one of the screen's great underrated performances.
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Lulu: Me, too.
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Add me to the list of those whom do not consider Brando the greatest actor. I thought what he was paid to be Superman’s father was obscene.
I have never used a bamboo steamer. I just toss my veggies together in a metal steamer that sits in any pot.
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I forgot-TCB-LOL
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DRLULU did you watch The Midwestern Hayride?
My parents did. Is LULU from Cincinnati?
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Emily, Jennifer and all of you living in a cold climate, I am sorry you aren’t having an Ashland perfect spring day.
JRand53 now I get it! (we should have a light bulb happy face). Feel free to point my errors out anytime-you certainly aren’t the first to do so. ;D ;D
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I am steaming an artichoke in an electric steamer.
Only here at haineshisway.com could you have such a sentence. I am playing my Goldsmith Box Set - very handsome.
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Welcome home, Joe!
Feel better, Em!
Thanks again for your sympathy everyone!
I love "My Funny Valentine." I've heard and sung quite a few arrangements, and it touches me every time.
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Thank you for the steaming info!
And yes, I'd neglected to send health vibes to the wilds of Canada. Feel better, Emily!
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LOL DR JANE. DRLULU has some Midwestern roots, so I was thinking she may have been subjected to Kenny Price.
RLP I also thought Brando's Fletcher Christian was very good....I love that movie!
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A great big hug to Joe!
(((((((Joe))))))))
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We had delicious steamed artichokes last night. I steamed them in a large pot (have never used an electric steamer) on little metal artichokes holders.
Off to mail a birthday card. I would prefer to stay & visit, but the card must go out today.
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This might be long, but, I wanted to hit all of the wonderful topics of the day!
I liked Jennifer Westfeldt in KISSING JESSICA STEIN. I don't have a problem with her on the WONDERFUL TOWN cd; she's the ingenue! The part has been sung much better - Rebecca Luker on the double disc WT; my problem with the new recording is, IMHO, the tempi are too darn slow!
BRANDO - it's like yesterday's discussion of Hart vs Sondheim; Brando is of an era, that era is passed. When Brando hit the screen, audiences has not seen such animal sexuality combined with his lithe, then-athletic, body and the intensity of his acting. I would rate him as an influential actor, but, give me Ronald Colman or Cary Grant. Brando's comedic skills leave a lot to be desired. . . .Favorite Brando performances: STREETCAR, MUTINY ON THE BOUNTY, LAST TANGO IN PARIS and THE NIGHTCOMERS.
RLP - please do tell us about the *other* hair.
DR Panni & DR PennyO - I'm in accord with your comments about La Streisand. There was a time when she was "Babs," and further back, she was simply Barbra Streisand, a gangly kid with a voice to die for! I'm glad that PennyO pointed out the Cook/Streisand phrasing, for I have always beleived that Streisand took a lot from Cook.
And, finally, Hart & Rodgers:
"You Have Cast Your Shadow on the Sea"
"It Never Entered My Mind"
"My Funny Valentine"
"Bewitched, Bothered and Bewildered"
"Our Den of Iniquity"
"I Didn't Know What Time it Was"
"To Keep My Love Alive"
"It's a Lovely Day for a Murder"
"Johnny One Note"
"Where's that Rainbow"
"The Most Beautiful Girl in the World"
and, from THE BOYS FROM SYRACUSE alone:
"He and She"
"Dear Old Syracuse" with a small correction to Mr. Moore's note of yesterday: It's "When the search for love becomes a mania, you can take the night boat to Albania."
"Falling in Love with Love" ( I love the verse to this)
"This Can't be Love"
"The Ladies of the Evening in the Morning" ("A plum becomes a prune, a joke becomes a pun, and daughters of the moon must fade beneath the sun.)
"What Can You Do with a Man?"
"Sing for Your Supper"
"O Diogenes"
"The Shortest Day of the Year"
and, finally, my all-time favorite Rodgers & Hart song:
TEN CENTS A DANCE.
[move=left,scroll,6,transparent,100%]! ! W E L C O M E H O M E J O E ! ! [/move]
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When MGM was producing "Words and Music," they recorded many more songs than they were able to use.
George Feltenstein oversaw the issue of a laserdisc boxed set called "MGM Composer Series" in which were presented special editions of "Till the Clouds Roll By" (Jerome Kern), "Words and Music" (Rodgers and Hart) and "Deep in My Heart" (Sigmund Romberg).
In addition to the films, they provided us with all the pre-recordings and alternate recordings of songs from all three films.
There is a treasure trove on those LDs...and among them is Betty Garrett singing a heartbreakingly gorgeous version of "My Funny Valentine."
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[quote author=td link=board=4;threadid=217;start=msg34271#msg34271 date=1079995855
"Dear Old Syracuse" with a small correction to Mr. Moore's note of yesterday: It's "When the search for love becomes a mania, you can take the night boat to Alban
DR TD, that was intentional: Rodgers & Hart's Ephesus is not so far from Manhattan: the producer Brothers Shubert were referred to as "the boys from Syracuse" and the night boat to Albania is a reference to the night boat that used to run up the Hudson River from New York to albany, and the subject of a Kern show "The Night Boat." My point was that most popular musicals, from Herbert's THE RED MILL of 1906 to musicals before Oscar Hammerstein promoted dramatic cohesion, could be set as far away as Holland, Ephesus, Budapest, but they always ended up in New York in their references.
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"Dear Old Syracuse" with a small correction to Mr. Moore's note of yesterday: It's "When the search for love becomes a mania, you can take the night boat to Albania."
Where did the quote go?
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Re our topic du jour, I was just reading an essay by Richard Rodgers in which he compares his various lyricists, and I came across this:
“…The following year, a Rodgers and Hart score for the Columbia Varsity Show also contained an interpolated Rogers and Hammerstein effort, “Room for One More." Oscar, incidentally, had been on the panel of judges that had selected our musical FLY WITH ME, as the Varsity Show. A few years later he even collaborated on the book for a musical WINKLE TOWN, with a score by Larry and me, but we never could sell it. The show, however, did have a song in it, “Manhattan,” that later became our first hit.”
Okay, so this got me thinking about an intriguing topic. Here’s a show by Rodgers and HartandHammerstein – and they couldn’t sell it! So I wonder how many other “dream shows” there are out there which on paper were made in heaven, but in the cold light of day (or opening night) went straight to the other place. Thoughts, DRs?…
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I did enjoy Brando's performance in SAYONARA, but then I hadn't really seen much of anything of his to compare it to. For my part I put him into that group of over-rated actors that people seem to think are really cool to like....Jack Nicholson for instance...that isn't to say that I don't like certain performances of either actor, I just don't find them personally all that appealing and I certainly wouldn't make a point of seeing one of their films just because they were in it...now Allison Hayes or Cal Bolder on the other hand! Well, there is just no comparison now is there! LOL! :D
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I just checked my original list and for some reason I didn't include a song I love, SPRING IS HERE -- so bittersweet, so heartbreakingly lovely. You'd swear it was written by a Hungarian.
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My God! Ruth Lyons, the 50-50 club, Bob Braun, Midwestern Hayride...this Cincy boy remembers them all! I know that Bob Braun was a big broad-shouldered guy, but I don't know that I'd characterize him as "an elephant of a guy", JRand. Bob actually had a few hit singles...probably regional...but one that got him enough play that he made an appearance on American Bandstand. Midwestern Hayride was also something of a Saturday ritual at our house (My Dad always like Bonnie Lou) and I remember Kenny Price before his Hee-Haw days. Who was the guy who had the Saturday talent show? I don't remember what it was called. I also actually got to meet Bob Shreve (he came to a show of mine at UK) of the classic Shoenling All-Night Theatre where Bob showed wonderful cheesy movies along with his cast of characters...Spidel and chickie and all the rest...Another famed Cincy TV personality, Nick Clooney, is presently running as a Democratic Congressional candidate from Northern Kentucky. I'm thinking of sending him a donation. I used to take guitar lessons at Wurlizter Music in downtown Cincy from a guy who occasionally played in Ruth Lyons' band on the show.
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I did not watch the Babs Steisand show, because I find Lipton an obsequious ass and Babs an over-indulgent, self-indulgent actress and film-maker. I used to like her as a singer, but I think she has become self-indulgent in that arena as well, far more interested in showing off her instrument than serving the song.
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I also usually steam my vegetables, but with a metal steamer in a pot. I think they are supposed to be much better for you if you only steam them for a short time. But personally I just hate hard broccoli.
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I just checked my original list and for some reason I didn't include a song I love, SPRING IS HERE -- so bittersweet, so heartbreakingly lovely. You'd swear it was written by a Hungarian.
Well, you know, DR Panni, it's from I MARRIED AN ANGEL of 1938 or so, set in Budapest. I believe it's even based on a Hungarian play.
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Oh and on the topic of the new WONDERFUL TOWN, I have not seen or heard Jennifer W yet. But I did see the Encores version with Laura Benanti. And she was wonderful. As was Donna Murphy. I actually could not believe how much I loved the show.
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LOL DRCHARLESPOGUE....Midwestern Hayride was IN COLOR as were all the WLW shows and that's the reason I watched most of them. I remember seeing Bob on American Bandstand (I have a couple of his albums) - and he looked so out of place! I guess my elephant crack was the way I remember him from the final days of the show!
I don't think the talent show made it to Indy and WLW-I, I don't remember it anyway. Yup I met Nick Clooney a few years ago when he was a speaker at an SPJ event, nice guy.
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Yup I met Nick Clooney a few years ago when he was a speaker at an SPJ event, nice guy.
In 1988 I worked with Michael Tilson Thomas on a Gershwin Gala for PBS and the Brooklyn Academy of Music. One of the stars was Rosemary Clooney, son of my friend Rafael. I told her I was from the Cincinnati area and she asked me if I ever got back there, and I said only when I had to. She said she felt the same way but she had to go back the following week for a wedding. Her last words then, pray for me. It's even funnier because we called Rafael Rosemary's baby.
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I saw a nice bio of Clooney on TV this past weekend...lots of reminiscing by sons Rafael, Gabriel and Miguel. There's a daughter, too, but I didn't get her name. The show was on a local PBS station as part of a fund-raising campaign.
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LOL elmore
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Well, you know, DR Panni, it's from I MARRIED AN ANGEL of 1938 or so, set in Budapest. I believe it's even based on a Hungarian play.
Well I did NOT know, Larry! That's one of the things I love about this site - because now I do. (Looked it up: "Based upon a play by Hungarian playwright Janos Veszary...")
That's really interesting - I'm sure Hart wasn't thinking, "How do I express a Hungarian emotional landscape here?..." But somehow he did. He probably has Hungarian genes. Most of the clever ones do, y'know.
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Well I did NOT know, Larry! That's one of the things I love about this site - because now I do. (Looked it up: "Based upon a play by Hungarian playwright Janos Veszary...")
That's really interesting - I'm sure Hart wasn't thinking, "How do I express a Hungarian emotional landscape here?..." But somehow he did. He probably has Hungarian genes. Most of the clever ones do, y'know.
Well, then I wish my family wasn't evicted from England around 1700 instead of east of the Danube!! We're WASP Gypsies, Tramps and Thieves, ya know!
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In absolute fairness to Lulu and her recollection of a comment I made, I found the reference in the 2/21/2003 notes in the archives. The subject that spurred my comment was about "The Fantasticks" and how "The Rape Ballet" had been removed out of deference to it no longer being an acceptable number because of subject matter:
I wrote:
I have vivid memories of a time in my military past when my commanding officer was addressing some fiscal changes that were about to come our way that would alter how we did business (i.e., doing more with less). As he put it, we would endure because, he said,"When rape is inevitable, the best thing to do is lie back and enjoy it."
Believe me when I tell you he got a hearty round of applause and lots of chuckles over that!
Since we are now being subjected to subliminal terrorism by our own government, it won't be long before everyone has caught on and a lot of this silliness surrounding "P.C." will disappear.
Posted by Ron Pulliam @ 02/21/2003 08:06 AM PST
It grieves me to see what I left unsaid.
I can clearly see what Lulu saw, and I totally apologize for the insensitivity of the remark as it stands.
I'm sure my point was that at the time the bromide was offered, no one took the bromide as approval of the act of rape or anything related to it. That's what my feeling was about "The Rape Ballet" -- that it was not intentionally offensive...and I was prattling on about how I felt folks who make it disappear were being over-PC.
Lulu was right. I was wrong by omission (and by virtue of not really thinking about what I was saying).
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Well, then I wish my family wasn't evicted from England around 1700 instead of east of the Danube!! We're WASP Gypsies, Tramps and Thieves, ya know!
I once read a book that set out to prove that anyone who mattered in a significant way in the affairs of the world was somehow of Hungarian descent. The thesis being that Hungarians are really aliens. When the aliens landed way back when, they realized that if they wanted to take over peacefully they'd have to mix their alien genes with the earth beings -- so they created an earth race - Hungarians - and spread out from there. The book went on to show that in every major aspect of human endeavor - whether it be the arts or the atom bomb - Hungarians were key. Just look at the development of the Bomb - Szilard, Teller, Wigner, et al.
The book also traced the roots of the British royal family. You guessed it!
So don't worry, you may think you're WASP, but mere facts are not always to be trusted.
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These days, RLP, it is a rare person, Internet or any other-wise, who will post something like you just did. Bravo.
I et my steamed artichoke with gobs of melted butter and I am now ready to purge. I also burned my finger on the metal thing I use to melt butter in. I put some neosporin on it, which will hopefully help it not blister too badly. That's the first time I've burned myself in thirty years.
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Hey everyone! HAPPY SONDHEIM BIRTHDAY! *feeds Andrew Lloyd Webber some crumbs from his cake*
Sorry I wasn't really around yesterday (it was wonderful reading your erudite and well-written thoughts on Sondheim and Hart).
I spent the day in DC with an online friend I was meeting for the first time, and we had a marvelous time.
I definitely agree that Sondheim's work is romantic and heartfelt while never being cloying or sentimental. I love that I can be stimulated on two levels at once---emotional and intellectual (although admittedly, in a few cases, the latter ecipses the former). Sunday in the Park with George is my favorite Sondheim musical, but I think it needs to be seen too for one to really feel the amazing emotional impact this show has. The score, I think, isn't one of Sondheim's most melodic...in some ways, it mirrors the pointilism of Seurat's work. But I also think it's one of his most deeply felt in the context of the show, and the fused relationships between Dot and Georges and Marie and George, just carry me to such a level of...I don't know how to describe it. It's just wonderfully deep and beautiful and climactic.
I adore Rodgers and Hart (in some ways even more than Rodgers and Hammerstein). I think that to be a cynic, one must have at one time been a great romantic, and I can hear this in Hart lyrics. Of course I also love the rhyming. I'm such a rhyme-whore.
My favorites are:
Where Or When
I Wish I was In Love Again
Johnny One Note
My Funny Valentine
Zip
I Could Write a Book
Falling in Love With Love
To Keep My Love Alive
Manhattan
It Never Entered My Mind
I Didn't Know What Time It Was
Thou Swell
Good vibes to WFO and Joe! I'm glad he's back home!
I really liked Jennifer Westfeldt in Wonderful Town. I loved her in Kissing Jessica Stein, probably my favorite romcom, and she didn't disappoint even next to such a goddess as Donna Murphy. I thought she balanced ingenuousness and sexy guile quite nicely.
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Bruce, ice first, then Neosporin. I use to use gobs of butter & slowly reduced the amount of butter until I could eat it plain or with just the tiniest amount of butter. Try it. It is much better for you and certainly less fattening.
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But I LOVE buttah.
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I would be remiss in my duty as the world's biggest geek if I failed to point out that today is also the birthday of Mr. William Shatner.
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Lulu was right. I was wrong by omission (and by virtue of not really thinking about what I was saying).
I’m impressed you went back to your original post and added additional comments. That was very nice of you.
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Bruce so did I but if you do it slowly you can even get to the point where too much butter doesn't take good-honest.
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DR RLP, you're a mensch.
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Evening all.
It's turning chilly (again) here in the land of sunshine. We're at 58 as I type this and it's going to be colder by morning.
I'm worried about my garden. Sigh. I just couldn't wait any longer to plant the seeds and my Michael Crawford Rose has a bloom on it already. I thought spring had well and truely sprung.
On a happy note, I received my Michael Ball tickets. I guess that means I'm not dreaming and I am going. It's only 53 days away but who is counting? ;)
[move=left,scroll,6,transparent,100%]Good vibes and welcome home to Joe![/move]
At least its over. Small comfort that considering.
I never was a big Steisand fan. I like some of her music but know next to nothing about her. I fear that is the same with most singers/celebs. I enjoy their work but I don't go past that. Yes, even in the case of Mr. Ball and Mr. Crawford. Except for knowing they come from England, I know very little about either man. :)
DR RPL, I think we have all posted something in haste or even not in haste but without thinking it all out. I do that on a regular basis. Sometimes much to my sorrow and sometimes much to my own amusement (Did I say THAT? What was I THINKING? Was I thinking?). :)
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When I used to drive from Montreal down to Florida I would take the thousand island bridge over into northern NY state through Watertown and other cities through Pennsylvannia before reconnecting with i-95 south of Washington DC.Which brings me to the reason for this post. Just as we leave the cities limits of that Northern NY state city I would always play Rodgers and Hart's I Wanna Go Back and It would drive my father crazy with it because I had it on repeat play.
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I am playing my Goldsmith Box Set - very handsome.
I really wanted to get that set, but there was too much of it that was reprising material from Film Score Monthly's Goldsmith CDs that I already had, which made its' hefty, hefty, hefty price tag all that much more unattractive for moi. I suppose I'll regret that decision someday. But not today.
I like FSM's CDs. But their liner notes leave a lot to be desired.
Like readability.
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Brando is a great actor if only for his amazing performance in ON THE WATERFRONT. If you add STREETCAR and THE GODFATHER you have a trifecta.
This is not considering other stellar performances one of which is the not ever mentioned tour-de-force in the movie THE MEN.
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Brando should've played Dick Tracy. He looks exactly like how Chester Gould drew him.
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Maya, all cynics were once romantics or idealists. Take it from a cynical, romantic idealist.
Elmore, I still get back to Cincinnati and Northern Kentucky whenever I can (Born in Cincy, but grew up on the Kentucky side of the river). Yeah, I know the place can be square and conservative, but roots, you know...It also has lots of lovely cultural perks...a terrific Art Museum, natural history museum, and I always like Cincinnati Playhouse in the Park.
But, of course, what really draws me back is Cincinnati Chili...I get two loaded conies and a four-way (spaghetti, chili, cheese, and onions. No beans!) in the airport, the minute I get off the plane.
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Some of my favorite Rodgers and Hart:
It Never Entered My Mind
Where or When (but the verse MUST be included)
Little Girl Blue
Isn't It Romantic?
My Romance
Zip!
Falling In Love With Love
My Heart Stood Still
Nobody's Heart Belongs To Me
This Funny World
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Welcome Home, Joe! I'm happy for both you and WFO that it's over.
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Rafi Ferrer was a high school friend of mine.
Throughout the 90's I worked with Letty Ferrer, Uta Hagen's daughter, but she thought of Rosemary Clooney as a second mother.
After hearing Donald's radio show, I'm thinking of adding A Lady Must Live to the Rodgers & Hart favorites list. I'm always singing BK's favorite whenever I'm near Sutton Place (which isn't often).
Very small turn-out for song improv tonight, which made it more exhausting for all. I'm hoping more people will show up for the Sunday night one-time-only class in songwriting. 3 hours of entertaining enlightenment for $20. Where could you do better?
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I didn't get around to watching DEADWOOD today, but unquestionably I will get around to it tomorrow.
As for THE SOPRANOS, last season and this season, the writers have been deliberately slow setting up the players for their season. I look for things to pick up steam in a week or two. Oh, they've already hooked me for sure, but an episode without Carmella is kind of unthinkable to me, and we just had one last night.
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Kudos (or Luna Bars) to both DRs RLP and Lulu for keeping this discussion on an adult level. This is so refreshing from what goes on at ratm.
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If I'm not mistaken since it was rather early this morning, I posted a picture which now seems to have vanished. Is thre a reason for this? I'd like to know, so I don't make the same mistake in the future.
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Hi all, I just wanted to post this. I got this news from Sarah.
Tonight at around 9:00 or 10:00, Nick Shomaker, a 15-year-old boy in Sarah's grade (and my bro's) at her/their school, was shot and killed in his basement. Apparently he was with two other kids, and shots were fired, but they don't know who did it yet.
Any thoughts, prayers, and good vibes for the family, friends, classmates, and anyone else affected would be greatly appreciated. May God rest Nick's soul.
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Just finished watching SILK STOCKINGS which I had taped off of TCM the other week...oh, I had forgotten how much I enjoyed that movie! As a grade schooler that was one of my favorite musicals and I watched it every time it aired on TV! Cyd Charisse is such a joy to watch dance and Janis Paige's two big numbers are some of my all time favorites in movie musical history!
Maybe I should buy the DVD!
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I have to put in my two cents worth on the Streisand bashing today....What I don't understand is the animosity - verging on contempt - towards this woman....
Dear DR Panni: it's because those who cannot stand Streisand are all closet Republicans!
;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
(As Bugs Bunny would say, "Ain't I a stinker!")
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Dear Readers Laura II and Swishy. . . . .
:'(
I can only offer up the best of vibes to you in this time of grief.
Too, too young. Too, too sad.
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that is very sad Laura. And it was just not too long ago that Sarah's young neighbor was killed. Very, very sad.
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I honestly don't know how to react to Laura's news. I'm just stunned.
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Condolences to Swishy and YoungLaura. The death of a classmate is so very difficult. You are all in my prayers.
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Re today's topics:
This will come as a great surprise to you all -- I have seen two Marlon Brando movies: Superman and Guys and Dolls.
I steam vegetables in the microwave. I rinse the veggies and cover the bowl with plastic wrap and microwave for a minute or so.
Not a fan of Barbra Streisand. I have no clue who the interviewer is.
I haven't heard enough Rodgers and Hart songs to pick a favorite. But Johnny One-Note is a lot of fun when Judy Kaye sings it.
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I remember being in school in the late 50s and early 60s (graduated in 1966). The worst thing that happened to one of my classmates is that he died of a ruptured appendix.
And at another school, a football player never recovered from a tackle during a game.
Those seemed like senseless tragedies at the time. Plus we had the assassinations of Kennedy, King and Kennedy.
Today, things like Nick's death are all too common. And always with guns.
Either accidental or gang-related or killing spree. There is nothing truly innocent in the world any more.
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Arrggggggghhhh...I hate insomnia.
Dear Reader RLP: I didn't look up the original remarks because I took your word that you hadn't meant them the way I had interpreted them. You are cool, man...cool. :)
Sarah and Laura II: Good thoughts headed out to both of you and your vicinity in general.
Jrand: I didn't have a clue what Midwestern Hayride was when I read your post. :) Now I see. Being an Indy girl, my TV memories are of Cowboy Bob and Janie, Timothy Churchmouse and Sammy Terry. Although yes, I DO remember Bob Braun.
Charles Pogue: Would you believe Skyline Chili is now in South Florida?? Perhaps they'll work their way out to California eventually. I lived very briefly in Cinti (at age 20) and quickly grew fond of Skyline. I, too, preferred the Four Way.
Tonight we watched Alfred Hitchcock's Family Plot (1976 - his final film). I surprised myself by really liking it. In fact, I prefer it to The Trouble with Harry (1955), another black comedy, which I found rather flat and inert...yet I'm pretty sure Harry is considered by film scholars to be the superior film. Go figure.
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Kerry: I pulled the post with the photo because it turned that page into widescreen. You'd have to size it down and post it again. It was a great photo.
When I hear news like Laura's I just realize how screwed up the world we live in is.
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Re today's topics:
This will come as a great surprise to you all -- I have seen two Marlon Brando movies: Superman and Guys and Dolls.
Dear Reader Laura--
You should make sure we are all seated when you makes comments like that. Imagine: 50% of all the films you have ever seen featured Marlon Brando.
;)
P.S. You simply must see The Godfather (which features Mr. Brando) and The Godfather Part II (which does not.)
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I steam vegetables in the microwave. I rinse the veggies and cover the bowl with plastic wrap and microwave for a minute or so.
Yes, most people forget that the microwave is great for steaming veggies. I find it much easier than on the stovetop, because I can control the amount of time I am steaming. I usually forget how quickly steam can cook things, and on the stove turn things to a disgusting mush.
Carrots, on the other hand, I do prefer to cook on the stovetop these days. Sliced into rounds, with some broth, some honey, and red pepper flakes, and let to simmer until the liquid becomes a glaze, makes for a very appetizing side dish. Or, instead of the pepper, a sprig of rosemary, bruised and removed at the end of cooking.
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News like Laura II's just leaves me speechless. What a world we live in! My thoughts go out to the boy's family and friends.