Topic: THE LATE SHOW (Read 22502 times)

Jason · « **Reply #60 on:** May 22, 2004, 01:34:49 PM »

Re: making back investments: WICKED will make back its money in 16 months if they continue to sell at 100% capacity, with people paying full price on those $100+ tickets. MILLIE sold very well after it opened--it was nearly impossible to get a ticket for many weeks--and then, all of a sudden, it became yesterday's news with HAIRSPRAY opening up the street. The Marquis is a HUGE theatre, and they've not come anywhere near filling it, unfortunately, for many months now--even when Sutton was still in the show. I can see where they won't make their money back on the Broadway production, but they'll make it back in spades on the tour. And trust me, since MTI got the amateur and regional rights to the show, people have been calling like crazy trying to get it.

Re. theatre groupies: I don't really understand it myself. I look at RENT-heads and think, "why!?" But then I look back on myself in the early '90's (I was a late theatre-bloomer) and I remember that I was most definitely a LES MIZ and PHANTOM-head. The idea of teenaged theatre fans is a great one, and while it's baffling to see so many teens rallying up for MILLIE or RENT or even VAMPIRES and TABOO, I think it's important to remember: THANK GOD KIDS ARE GOING TO THE THEATRE! I don't say this to be offensive, but many of them are the theatre queens and "hags" of the future who have just recently discovered musicals (and in many cases, themselves), and many of them jump on the bandwagon of whatever show got them hooked. PHANTOM was the show that got me--I have no shame in admitting that--and I still defend the virtues of that show to this day. And living in the midwest, it was difficult to see these shows that I loved so much, so I went every chance I had. I saw PHANTOM three times in Louisville...twice in Nashville, TN and once in Dallas, TX. Now that I'm in New York, I've seen it twice and I know if I wanted to see it again, it's just a hop-skip-and-a-jump off the E-train. I think sometimes people in "the biz" (mostly, those of us who live in New York), take live theatre for granted in the sense that here there's relatively easy access to it. Maybe not financially easy, but there are ways to see it if you really want to. For these kids out in Oklahoma City or Madison, WI, Broadway seems worlds away, and cast recordings and national tours are their only exposure to these shows. If and when they get the rare opportunity to visit New York, they stock up on their favorite show(s). It's like teens and rock bands, I guess. I don't understand Dead-Heads, but they're out there...and people literally followed the Grateful Dead around the country.

I think it's also important to look at the messages that these shows that people flock to are making. MILLIE is about a young girl coming out of her shell--finding herself. RENT is about a group of misfits in various stages of love, who accept each other and love each other despite their flaws and differences. PHANTOM: A flawed man pining for the love of a beautiful girl that he can never have, but she sort of falls for him anyway--not because of his looks, but because of his soul. LES MIZ: The downtrodden searching for hope and love in a time where there seemed to be none. TABOO: Misfits trying to find their place in the world. All of these shows have messages that teenagers can relate to. Obviously there's SOMETHING to the story of RENT--we don't really question people who see LA BOHEME every year. People have been reading LES MISERABLES and PHANTOM OF THE OPERA since they were first published, and teenagers have been looking for their "place" in the world ever since Cain and Abel. I think that's why they go. But that's just my opinion...

bk · « **Reply #61 on:** May 22, 2004, 01:36:48 PM »

Irwin Winkler is one of the world's worst directors. He was a fine producer, but a director he's not and never will be. There is no way the film will be good - cannot happen.

Noel · « **Reply #62 on:** May 22, 2004, 01:41:25 PM »

Quote from: bk on May 22, 2004, 12:56:31 PM

I don't believe those Variety figures, otherwise someone would have to explain why a lower-budgeted show like Millie has not paid off after TWO YEARS. Uh uh. Avenue Q, maybe... MAYBE. It was much lower budgeted and is much cheaper to run, so it's possible.

Why would you say that Millie is "lower-budgeted?" It has a large number of speaking roles, a full-sized chorus, it appeared to have a pretty big orchestra (does DR Elmore know the figure?) and those sets - including a working elevator. (Well, it only works when you tap dance in it.) If that's not a higher-budgeted show, what is?

bk · « **Reply #63 on:** May 22, 2004, 01:42:04 PM »

Certainly I went back to shows I loved, IF I had the money. But in those days it cost me about five bucks for a primo orchestra seat. I did see Stop the World three times, but I was no groupie - I just loved the show and new it would only be in LA for three weeks. What baffles me today is kids shelling out huge amounts of moolah to see the same show ten or twenty times and behaving like screaming raving maniacs in the theater. I hate that. I love an excited reaction or a thrilling ovation, but not one that's like a rock concert. I've been party to standing Os that were deserverd, where there was much "bravo" being shouted, but somehow it was more respectful of the THEATER. I find this topic fascinating.

Jason · « **Reply #64 on:** May 22, 2004, 01:47:43 PM »

BK: The whooping and hollering bothers me, too. Thankfully, that hasn't happened too much in shows that I've seen here. Maybe it does at RENT, but I've not heard people screaming and hollering in the balconies of BOY FROM OZ or WICKED...not even at HAIRSPRAY.

I think a lot of those issues are simply behavioral, which is a whole other issue. As to paying loads of money to see shows over and over and over...well, I say if they've got the cash, let 'em spend it on theatre. It's better than buying a bag of dope or a twelve-pack of booze, right?

S. Woody White · « **Reply #65 on:** May 22, 2004, 01:49:24 PM »

All right, BK, since Jason and I seem to be seeing pretty eye-to-eye here, as to why certain shows attract the youth audience, let's back up a bit and look at what shows you were seeing when you were "that age." A list of titles might be helpful here.

Tomovoz · « **Reply #66 on:** May 22, 2004, 01:55:28 PM »

In then land of OZ it looks like "The Producers" will actually succeed financially. Nearly everything else has failed in recent years. No-one wanted to know about "The Full Monty", "Sunset B" could not find an audience and nor could revivals of "Showboat" and "Man Of La Mancha". "Rent" didn't make the grade either. "B & The B" lost money too. The big exception in the post "Phantom" and "Les Mis" years was "Mama Mia".
On the other hand, mount an in-concert version of "Grease" or "JC Superstar" and the punters flock in to the "arenas" to see their pop favourites perform. Both shows are sure fire tickets sellers in non-professional theatre too. The other show that does not seem to run out of lives is "The Rocky Horror Show".
The successful shows are the "pop" star vehicles. The young audience does not seem to get the "bug" and visit tradional style musicals. Even gimmick laden musicals like "Witches Of Eastwick" could not find an audience.
Subsidised professional theatre has managed to provide us with some Sondheim shows (Night Music, Assassins, Woods) and at present "Urinetown". They have done well for short seasons but it is the subscription theatre season bookings that assure them of a "run" in the first place.
I guess the next show to make money here will be "Tonight's The Night" if Rod Stewart songs can have the same impact as ABBA. There is no much hope finding any audience for or staging a "Ragtime" here.
The only hope and joy we get is from non-professional theatre.

Tomovoz · « **Reply #67 on:** May 22, 2004, 01:57:25 PM »

Final note: I don't think we have the "Theatre Groupies" here. Who could afford to be?

Jrand73 · « **Reply #68 on:** May 22, 2004, 02:05:17 PM »

Interesting.

Hmmmmmmmmm.....I didn't see a lot of shows even as a teen because there weren't any....

But I was familiar with GYPSY, THE MUSIC MAN, and HOW TO SUCCEED because my dance-gymnastic teacher provided the "kids" for these shows for the "under the stars" productions (that is under the night time stars).... And I knew the records because we bought them through the Columbia Record Club.

I did always go back to see the musicals on the screen as often as I could while they were in town....and I wanted to be part of the world, but it was a bit muddled in my mind whether I liked theatre or film better.

Tomovoz · « **Reply #69 on:** May 22, 2004, 02:20:25 PM »

Maybe parents don't take their children to live theatre these days so it is not a "learning experience". Children's theatre - I guess it is the English tradition - of pantomime was an anticipated event each Chistmas of my childhood. Of course it was a childhood without Television and the entertainment alternatives of today! Young audiences take their pop concert behaviour into the theatre.

Panni · « **Reply #70 on:** May 22, 2004, 02:22:42 PM »

I was a Laurence Olivier groupie. The National Theater of Great Britain came to TO with a number of productions -- horrendously expensive - and I went to see them all. To see Larry! Used up all the money I'd saved. But it was worth it.
And I loved ballet. Went to the National Ballet as often as possible. When I grew up and was a writer I became friendly with a a few of the dancers (Veronica Tennant for one) and it was a huge thrill for me to actually have some of these heroes of mine in my home.

Tomovoz · « **Reply #71 on:** May 22, 2004, 02:23:42 PM »

The shows of my childhood were "Kismet", "The Pajama Game", "My Fair Lady" "Oliver" and "The Sound Of Music". Family outings and they were affordable.

Jrand73 · « **Reply #72 on:** May 22, 2004, 02:24:32 PM »

Great story, Panni! And yes, if I had to choose between having a bit of extra money and seeing a show....well there is NO choice!

And DRJAY - I love the idea of "The Beeze and I" nearly as much as I like the idea of "The King and U."

Panni · « **Reply #73 on:** May 22, 2004, 02:26:57 PM »

And I saw lots and lots of musicals, of course. My favorite (on stage) was Camelot. It was SO tragic and romantic. Saw all the big musical films, natch. Those were expensive, too. But worth every penny.

bk · « **Reply #74 on:** May 22, 2004, 02:28:57 PM »

Dear S. Woody White:

While I could provide you with a list of titles, you do have a lovely novel entitled Kritzer Time, which you have been avoiding like the plague for what, close to three months? Why don't you try reading the book - all you answers lie within.

bk · « **Reply #75 on:** May 22, 2004, 02:36:15 PM »

S. Woody has left the room. Perhaps to read a book? Doubtful.

bk · « **Reply #76 on:** May 22, 2004, 02:40:04 PM »

And not to beat a dead horse but where in tarnation IS everyone?

Jason · « **Reply #77 on:** May 22, 2004, 02:42:12 PM »

That's a great story, Panni. If you're ever in New York in the early summer, let me know...I can probably get tickets to the American Ballet Theatre for you.

I blame my parents for starting me in the theatre, though they'd rather die than admit it's their fault. When I was six, we were living in England, and they took me to see a stage production of BUGSY MALONE for my birthday. (A 14-year old Catherine Zeta-Jones starred as Talulah.) After that, we saw Topol in FIDDLER and Richard Harris in CAMELOT. I slept through those two, but I vividly remember Tevye's nightmare and thought to be terrifying and thrilling all at the same time.

It was nearly ten years later that I discovered PHANTOM and once I heard that overture, I was hooked for life. I found out from my piano teacher that there was such a thing as the Broadway Series in Louisville (a subscription series that brought in 6-8 national tours every year) and I begged my parents for a subscription for my birthday. Jenny, my piano teacher, was going to subscribe, too, so we could go together. The first season included a bang-up season: GUYS AND DOLLS with Lorna Luft, EVITA, ASPECTS OF LOVE, BREAKING LEGS starring Gary Sandy and Karen Valentine, THE SECRET GARDEN, THE WORLD GOES ROUND and LES MISERABLES (LES MIZ was a season extra...I had to pay more for that one). The next year, PHANTOM was on the schedule, and the night that I was supposed to see it, a big snow storm blew into town. It hardly ever snows in Louisville, and I cried like a baby when I thought I might not get to see it. I had to change my tickets to another night (they upgraded me) and after three years of imagining what the show really looked like, I got to see THE PHANTOM OF THE OPERA from very center seat of the 12th row of the orchestra in Louisville's 2,500-seat theatre. When that chandelier flew over my head, I felt like I was the only person in that building and when it was over, I was moved to tears. Eight years later, I got to perform CARMEN on that very stage.

I didn't speak to my dad when he came to pick me up from the theatre--I couldn't find the words to describe it--and he didn't make me try. He just let me be. That was probably the most magical theatrical experience I've ever had. Now my friend, Julie, is the standby for Christine in the Broadway production of the show. When she was on the road (I saw her in Dallas), she gave us a backstage tour and I could barely focus because I was so excited and overwhelmed. To have been able to touch the chandelier...to stand onstage with the HANNIBAL elephant--I thought I'd die and gone to musical theatre Heaven.

bk · « **Reply #78 on:** May 22, 2004, 02:43:21 PM »

Now, you bookworm players - I want to know the secret when those stupid burning tiles start showing up, one after another, with no way of keeping up with them. Is there a secret?

Jason · « **Reply #79 on:** May 22, 2004, 02:46:36 PM »

BK: The more you click on the worm to scramble the letters, the more burning tiles you get. You won't get higher scores this way, but I usually try to get rid of the burning ones as soon as they pop up by forming a three- or four-letter word with them while they're still up on top. Once they're gone, you can leisurely go back to making those high-point words.

Jrand73 · « **Reply #80 on:** May 22, 2004, 02:52:00 PM »

Andy Griffith and Patricia Neal - A FACE IN THE CROWD - Elia Kazan.

In the realm of remarkable performances in remarkable films....Neal has rarely been matched in this role, IMHO. Everyone here is doing great work.....

Jrand73 · « **Reply #81 on:** May 22, 2004, 02:53:48 PM »

Me too, DRJASON, as soon as one shows up I try to get rid of it. And three letter words make even MORE red tiles show up. Try for at least four letter words.

elmore3003 · « **Reply #82 on:** May 22, 2004, 02:57:41 PM »

Quote from: Noel on May 22, 2004, 01:41:25 PM

Why would you say that Millie is "lower-budgeted?" It has a large number of speaking roles, a full-sized chorus, it appeared to have a pretty big orchestra (does DR Elmore know the figure?) and those sets - including a working elevator. (Well, it only works when you tap dance in it.) If that's not a higher-budgeted show, what is?

DR Noel, I haven't thought about the MILLY orchestra since I saw the show, but my memory of counting the original players listed in the Playbill of 2001 tells me it was around 22 players. There was a full compliment of brass and reeds; it's always the strings that get cut back and a synth fills out the string sound. I feel this inhibits string writing but producers would rather pay for a string quartet and synth than 10 or so string players.

Jason · « **Reply #83 on:** May 22, 2004, 03:08:02 PM »

Just checked the Playbill...MILLIE, when it first opened, had 22 players, one conductor and two associate conductors. Four violins, one or two cellos.

Charles Pogue · « **Reply #84 on:** May 22, 2004, 03:40:44 PM »

BK - Book Fair this weekend at the Pasadena Center.

Be there or be round.

Jennifer · « **Reply #85 on:** May 22, 2004, 04:13:04 PM »

Oh I really want to see De-lovely. Does anyone know when it will be in wide release?

Jane · « **Reply #86 on:** May 22, 2004, 04:13:56 PM »

Quote from: Jason on May 22, 2004, 02:42:12 PM

That's a great story, Panni. If you're ever in New York in the early summer, let me know...I can probably get tickets to the American Ballet Theatre for you.

A reason to go to NY in the early summer.

I was lucky to have a father who loved the ballet. The last time we went to the ballet together was at the Greek Theater, a very long time ago.

Jennifer · « **Reply #87 on:** May 22, 2004, 04:18:49 PM »

For BK and DR Panni: Don't forget your Dick Van Dyke and Carol Burnett specials are on tonight.

François de Paris · « **Reply #88 on:** May 22, 2004, 04:50:46 PM »

Thank you, Dear Reader Jason for a great testimony of your love for musical theater; moving and thrilling!

.... and I'm still one of those people who haven't seen Les Miz or Phantom!

News from the Cannes Film Festival:

Palme d'Or to "Fahrenheit 9/11" by Michael Moore

The Palme d'Or of this 57th edition of the Festival de Cannes was presented by Charlize Theron to Fahrenheit 9/11 by Michael Moore.

"I can't begin to express my appreciation and my gratitude to the jury, the Festival, to Gilles Jacob, Thierry Frémaux, Bob and Harvey at Miramax, to all of the crew who worked on the film. [...] I have a sneaking suspicion that what you have done here and the response from everyone at the festival, you will assure that the American people will see this film. I can't thank you enough for that. You've put a huge light on this and many people want the truth and many want to put it in the closet, just walk away. There was a great Republican president who once said, if you just give the people the truth, the republicans, the Americans will be saved. [...] I dedicate this Palme d'Or to my daughter, to the children of Americans and to Iraq and to all those in the world who suffer from our actions. "

Ham chunks, cheese slices and diet cokes are on ME tonight!

François de Paris · « **Reply #89 on:** May 22, 2004, 04:57:14 PM »

Grand Prix to "Old Boy" by Park Chan-Wook

The Grand Prix was presented by Kevin Kline and Ashley Judd to Old Boy by Park Chan-Wook.

"I would like to thank all the members of the Jury and the Cannes Festival," said the South Korean director. "I met Roman Polanski at a party and we had our photograph taken together. That was already such an honour that I really didn't expect to win a prize [...] The fact that this great director said 'good luck' to me was such an honour. I dedicate this prize to the whole crew."

When asked by a journalist at the post-press conference about the mixed canvas his film conveys : “With the advent of the DVD and other digital supports, the possibility to watch a film more than once exists. And I made this film with the intention that people would watch it again and discover new elements each time.”

News:

Author Topic: THE LATE SHOW (Read 22502 times)

François de Paris

François de Paris